Welcome Back, Kyle Lowry!
by Tom Martin on Jul 14, 2010 3:40 PM CDT
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Four more years of hustle, bulldogishness, reckless drives and STABILITY.
Welcome back to the Rockets, Kyle!
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"Lowry, with another offensive rebound! Why I tell you, this guy is always in there"
That’s Bill Worell. Every single game of the season.
Daryl Morey is god
by xNevermind on Jul 14, 2010 3:41 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
What I'm trying to say is...
I love basketball because of Kyle Lowry. I love Kyle Lowry. Kyle Lowry.
"The French Army: Better defender than David Lee" - JE Skeets, in response to David Lee getting a vote for Defensive Player of the Year.
looking for the vid
after the hornets rockets game last game of season, they interviewed lowry i believe…wanna re watch it
by EveryHoustonTeamRox! on Jul 14, 2010 4:05 PM CDT reply actions
Great news
Although we all knew this was going to happen.
IMWT
by basketball is cool on Jul 14, 2010 4:20 PM CDT reply actions
Uh oh
“Daryl called me and told me he intended on matching Kyle’s offer sheet and my response to him was obviously he’s your restricted free agent and you are entitled to match,” Miller said, according to the report. “We preferred to have a negotiation in earnest, rather than the marketplace shaping Houston’s value of Kyle.”
Well Mr. Miller, you suck at this negotiating thing and managing your client. You are looking at it all wrong. This is Morey saying, you go out and get the most money anyone will pay you, and we’ll match that, because we think you’re worth top dollar.
www.TheDreamShake.com Co-Founder and Writer
Agent should be happy wiht kyles money.
a back up pg should not be making more than this anyways.
That's the thing though
Lowry wanted to start, and got offered starter money to go somewhere else, but the Rockets matched the price. A starting PG should be making this much money at least.
Is this our Summer League game thread?
I’m watching the Denver game about a quarter delayed, and Chase is personally destroying the Nuggets. Like, he’s outscored them by 10 early.
Can't get it here at work
Glad Chase is turning around his shooting
www.TheDreamShake.com Co-Founder and Writer
Rocket gets no respect
second straight day a rockets game has problems on broadband, damn it NBA
Tom its no way
we keep them both long term. The decision will be made either to pay Brooks more then six mill a year , or keep Lowry. I think Lowry is the better fit for our team with Yao and a full seaon for Martin. Brooks is suited better for last year when we need him to pick up the scoring slack. Brooks turns it over too much for a pg, and is a liability on d. Lowry’s pass first game is perfect for our team.
by since86rocketsfan on Jul 14, 2010 4:38 PM CDT reply actions
got to disagree with you
they are both great in different ways. How many times did Brooks make the other team dizzy and look stupid as he blurred past them. Yao and Brooks are different styles based on their speed differences but Brooks is a huge scoring threat on the perimeter for Yao to pass to and when Yao is on the bench Brooks can get the guys running and wear down the other team.
I didnt say they
cant fit in together. Of course Brooks is a scoring point guard, and Lowry a more complete pass first point guard. The bottom line is this, Brooks is only getting 1 mill a year, so when this contract ends he will get a raise. He will want starter money, which will probaly be more than 6 mill. Lowry can start, and wants to eventually be a starter. If the Rockets choose to pay Brooks a big deal, then that means they see him as the future point guard of the team. Its no way they pay 14-16 mill a year for point guards. Morey traded Landry to get Martin, because we had no true two guard, and he knew Landry is going to want a big deal. If they give AB the deal they will eiher trade Lowry, or Lowry probaly will request a trade. By not being able to sign any players this off season, it was no way we could lose Lowry or Scola, thus why Lowry’s offer sheet was matched so quickly.
by since86rocketsfan on Jul 14, 2010 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Disagree.
Brooks and Lowry add enough different stuff that they played significant minutes alongside each other. On a team with only one pure shooting guard (Martin) then having two complementary point guards is a reasonable thing.
The only reason I could see getting rid of one of them is for an upgrade at another position or if Les feels the team isn’t performing at a high enough level to justify going over the luxury tax, and we won’t know that for a while.
For this season I think they will both be Rockets
but after that I think one of them will be gone. Lowry won’t be happy for too much longer being a backup and Brooks will demand a lot more money, so I’m sure at some point Morey will have to choose. Hope I’m wrong though, love them both
by danielcp0303 on Jul 14, 2010 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions
That's fair.
And honestly they’re both good enough that we don’t need them both, I wouldn’t be surprised if one (probably Brooks because I think his perceived value is higher) is packaged with expiring contracts and picks to upgrade another position, even this year at the trade deadline.
what since86 is saying GUYS, is both players are great for us,
BUT THE MONEY ISN"T THERE FOR BOTH. Brooks prolli get a Rondo contract, 12 mil+ range a year. That’s just a lot of money to pay. for 4 mil a year more you can get yourself a superstar( if they grew off of trees.)
Sell Brooks short
when his stats give you star production, I don’t want to hear the star BS. Pay the men, keep the best PG tandem in basketball together, and contend. The money is there for both, it’s a question of if the Rockets want to contend they have to pay, if not, they can use that “Star players get almost as much” bullshit and try to trade Brooks for a player with an overinflated name who will come in and give us essentially Aaron’s stats, all because Rockets fans are unappreciative of their talent.
I'm always right, this isn't conjecture, merely statement of fact.
by BD34 on Jul 15, 2010 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Interesting (though largely meaningless) that the Rockets didn't wait to match.
That seems like standard procedure for most other teams.
Maybe he didn't wanna make the Cavs sweat it out
like Lebron did
by danielcp0303 on Jul 14, 2010 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions
My guess: politics. I’m sure you’re doing a GM a favour by not waiting to match, and it’s possible the Rockets and Cavs are on good terms.
Of course, the scheming cynic in me says that Morey is helping the Cavs out so they can compete against the Knicks in free agency. The more teams are better than the Knicks next year, the better for us. Hehehehe.
the best part is that hes only 24 yrs old, hes just gona get better
kinda scary ;)
Rockets-Texans-Dynamo-Longhorn fan.. used to be Astros too, but not sure there a pro team anymore
The real numbers for Lowry's contract
Jonathan_Feigen – Kyle Lowry’s contract, from sources: $5.75 million in each of the first 3 seasons, $6.25 million in last yr, w/ $1 mil guaranteed.
I think Brooks should be making more.
I also think Yao should be making more, he makes a bit less than Pau Gasol???
Yao made ~16 mil last season sitting on the pine.
Gasol actually plays and won a championship, so if anything Yao deserves less money.
No way Taylor becomes the 3rd point guard
too many careless turnovers
by danielcp0303 on Jul 14, 2010 5:23 PM CDT up reply actions
My cautious vote for 3rd PG would be Ish Smith.
Of course, my “blue sky” vote for 3rd PG would be Chris Paul… ;)
…and by “3rd” I mean “1st”, obviously, but you know what I’m getting at.
by DribbleHooper on Jul 15, 2010 4:28 AM CDT up reply actions
lowry is a beats point blank period
lowry is a dog man… dat man goes to da paint and sacrifice his body every game… i love dat bout him…i could watch him play any day…i think dat his style fits da rockets more den brooks but den again brooks can hit 3s wit yao…i jus hope dey play lowry alot more den other back up pgs
Ima d*ck so i shouldnt be dat hard to swallow
replace D with Th...
And you might have a point.
"The French Army: Better defender than David Lee" - JE Skeets, in response to David Lee getting a vote for Defensive Player of the Year.
by flipasta on Jul 14, 2010 6:44 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
Hopefully Lowry worked on his mid range jumper this summer
Brooks and Lowry complement each other which makes it tough for other teams. They were saying on 610 radio that with Lowry’s big contract, that could mean trading Brooks since he is making less than Lowry, but i don’t see it that way. Unless this is Brook’s expiring contract, they won’t trade him at least this year. I think Rox want both of them to play together for a few more years.
Brooks will be a restricted free agent next year
But we are gonna pay him some big bucks
Especially since Yao’s contract will be up, we will most likely re-sign him for less than what he’s making now
And Jeffries is out of here with his big-ass contract.
Daryl Morey is god
I think people forgetting the lock out when they pencil ABZ in for big bucks
Yes, he’s worth more than 6MM a year, but he might only be able to get 8
www.TheDreamShake.com Co-Founder and Writer
So the teams that already locked ppl up long term are safe.
The rest of us could be screwed with the new salary cap.
Let's keep in mind
Aaron is due his raise heading into a lockout season. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him take a potentially lowball offer just to lock up a contract. The new CBA should have a pitch for a hard cap and lower salaries, that’s why you lock up what you can by mid season via extension and just stay happy, enjoy your year off and bankroll for the upcoming seasons after it’s all sorted out.
I'm always right, this isn't conjecture, merely statement of fact.
Rockets don't work that way, so far at least
They don’t really do mid-season extensions. And since Aaron is a RFA, they have no reason at all to do it.
If a lockout happens, there will be no time for ABZ to even negotiate with another team before a strike shortened season, so there might be reason to believe he HAS to take whatever the Rockets, or possibly the team he gets traded to at the deadline, offer him.
www.TheDreamShake.com Co-Founder and Writer
Speaking of
Anyone know what happened during the last strike with these kind of deals?
www.TheDreamShake.com Co-Founder and Writer
For me
I think that’s why the Rockets do business mid season and lock him up. It gives the Rockets the most leverage. Aaron can still try to get paid and secure his money before a lockout takes place and introduces lower salaries and less years. The Rockets can dangle a price tag, a guarantee under the earlier CBA, and avoid having to see any matches later on. Aaron would be wise to take a fair offer from the Rockets rather than go unemployed for a season or until negotiations can pick back up.
I'm always right, this isn't conjecture, merely statement of fact.
Does anybody else think he'd be better as a starter...
since he’s better at distributing then AB, and would have Martin, Scola and Yao as 3 very capable scorers, and then AB would be an instant offense option off the bench with CBud and co?
First post; i get headaches reading CF. i’m glad i finally found TDS!!!!!!!
With Yao
You need to spread the floor with shooters, He creates so much attention that everyone gets one or 2 wide open looks. ABZ is an accomplished shooter, Lowry isnt. He’s better fit as running our up tempo team where we can take advantage of his slashing abilities. which is not to say Lowry cant run the first team offense, which he does fine filling in in spots but a consistent jumpshot mask a lot of thing and the lack of one usually drags you down a bit
i wish...
we could genetically combine them…and then clone to have 2.
but yeah, good points…i just get frustrated when AB gets careless with the TOs. seeing Yao play with 3 wing players with legit 3pt range and a PF that can hit the mid range should be fun to watch.
I would disagree about Brooks being carelss with TOs
As a point guard who plays so much with the ball, turnovers will happen. And if you look at the stats he had less turnovers than Deron Williams, Rajon Rondo and Steve Nash. He averaged 2.8 TOs a game which is around most of the top PGs in the league. Kyle Lowry per 36 minutes averages 2.5 TOs a game.
by danielcp0303 on Jul 14, 2010 10:19 PM CDT up reply actions
looking at the hard numbers...
means u miss the game play. AB has “low” TO numbers for a starting PG b/c:
1. the Rockets know he’s not a true pass-first PG that can run the plays, therefore he’s asked to handle the ball less than the elite PGs u listed. on Rocket offensive possessions, the ball spends a lot of time in the hands of the wing player trying to make entry passes to Yao or Scola, see: Scola ran a lot of high post sets last year with Yao out.
2. Lowry, being the awesome back up PG he is, plays a LOT of minutes for a back up PG, and also does the ball handling when he’s on the court with AB. So comparing him to elite PGs that play 35-40 minutes a game, whose teams run everything thru them, yeah, AB will have less TOs. (and by proxy, elevates Lowry’s TO numbers since he handles the ball so much too).
3. finally, when i say careless, its not as much about numbers, but mostly when u watch the game, and the pass just looks ill-advised from the get-go. trying to thread the needle when there really is NO lane, or being too late with the pass and the lane disappearing on him. on thing that is a definite fundamental no-no is when he drives to the baseline and jumps to leave his feet with no real plan in mind. a seasoned vet like Nash would dribble back out and re-set. i’d say give him time to mature, but this is gonna be year 4. he is what he is, not that there’s anything wrong with him, just as long as he’s used correctly.
long-winded, i know…AB’s not my whipping boy, it’s just that i believe the Rockets haven’t had a quality PG since Cassell was traded.
AB is a scoring point guard
who has low TO numbers…we didn’t lose games last year or the year before because Aaron Brooks was turning the ball over. A lot of the turnovers last year came because he had to make the plays himself until Kevin Martin came along. When Brooks took over the team 2 years ago with a healthy Yao Ming, he really took good care of the ball. And Brooks does run the plays and also has the ball in his hands just as often as the elites. (except for Nash) When Yao is on the floor this year Brooks will be the guy running the offense because of his effciency and Lowry will run with Yao on the bench. I love both of them and they both have a great role with the team, but Brooks is more trusted with the ball.
by danielcp0303 on Jul 14, 2010 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions
2 years ago, AB had to defer to Yao...
but i’m telling u that i feel better with a true pass-first PG that distributes the ball better, while AB sometimes has very pretty passes, i still think Lowry’s a better distributor…like the poster below said, AB and all other “scoring PGs” can be reckless with the ball at times. i still think the best way to judge a PG is if he makes his teammates better. does AB do that?
AB absolutely makes his teammates better
Martin and Yao have said that before. I understand what you mean about a pass first point guard, but how many pass first point guards aren’t capable of scoring? You have to be a threat to do both and that is the knock on Lowry. No real jumpshot and scores all of his points at the rim and on the line.
by danielcp0303 on Jul 15, 2010 9:11 AM CDT up reply actions
spot on...
i’m sure AB makes them better, but i guess what i had in mind was steve nash turning Amare from athletic scrub to All-Star, but there’s only 1 steve nash. and yeah, a consistent J is what’s keeping Lowry on the bench for sure, esp since the starting 5 is an inside-outside group. hence: combine DNAs and clone.
Amare was good before Nash got there
he was the freakin rookie of the year. he has got talent. yes nash made him better but that is his job but dont discredit STAT
GO ROCKETS, GO TEXANS, GO ASTROS (EVEN THOUGH THEY SUCK)!!!
hahaha
he’s got talent, but nash made him what he is today. and Yao deserved that ROY just as much if not more than Amare. i guarantee he’ll be less than in NY, def not worth $20 mill/year. KMart was pretty good until JKidd left.
the Rockets don't operate this way . . .
In a motion offense (which we run with and without Yao), you don’t need a true PG because the coach / GM make sure to load the team up with a bunch of guys who will avg 3-6 assists a game, rather than one who averages 10 and everyone else 1-2.
The Rockets essentially have two strategies when Yao is on the floor: put him in the low post, have everyone else moving away from him to create space, but not remaining stationary in order to create potential open shots. The defense either doubles Yao, leaving a shooter or slasher open, or they play him single coverage and Yao scores.
The second strategy is more of an answer to a fronting defense – stick Yao in the high post, motion initiates, players look to get to the rim since Yao is drawing the biggest guy on the floor away from the basket.
We can still run the pick-and-roll game, but in my opinion, they’re going to try to limit Yao’s mobility as he recovers from this major surgery, thus, sticking the ball in HIS hands more often than not seems to make sense, compared to a ‘true pg’ who tries to feed the ball to guys who aren’t going to be ignored on defense.
Comparatively, a ‘pass-friendly’ pg works wonders on our bench because of its offensive strategy: off-ball screens, curl screens, slashing and extremely fast pace.
Thus, a guy who can legitimately hit a 26 footer consistently at the point works tremendously in a Yao-centric system; conversely, a pass-first point works tremendously on a bench that is well-rounded.
Wafer . . . again. (Marv Albert, HOU v. CLE Feb 2009)
-one of the FEW at Toyota Center who has the Wafer jersey
thanks...
captain obvious :)
i think in theory, that’s what they try to do, but the problem is that everything slows down when nobody cuts/slashes. when the double comes to Yao, he’s got nowhere to pass to b/c everyone’s standing still and guarded. i think the Rockets have had spacing issues for awhile, but we’ll see with a new squad playing together for the first time. im psyched to see Yao and Martin on the court together and Ariza back in his proper role.
To tell you the truth
I think true point guards in the NBA are few and rare. I would argue only D-Williams, Chris Paul, J-kidd and Steve Nash(maybe Rondo, but he has so much space playing with those 3 guy spreading the defense) are fit for such titles. Great PGs can have high turn-over because they pass so much, it’s sometimes a synthetic product due to shear volume. Like Steve Nash leading the league in TOs couple years ago.
I dont think AB is careless, he’s a good passer, a great shooter and a great penetratior. AB’s primary weapon is speed, He’s not you prototypical point, but he can make the team better simply by being on the court, think Tony Parker and Devin Harris, both of those guys are reckless at time, but their speed far overwhelms that flaw
Welcome aboard
The thing about Brooks isn’t that he has such a high turnover rate, but that a lot of his turnovers really ARE just careless. It’s one if my few real criticisms of Brooks. Turning it over because you’re trying to make a play is one thing. Turning it over due to a sloppy pass is another.
"Each in turn... volunteered his suggestions, his invaluable suggestions."
by Xiane on Jul 15, 2010 3:06 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I kinda like Kyle's role as instant energy off the bench.
I wouldn’t mind seeing him start a few games, though, just to see the difference.
by DribbleHooper on Jul 15, 2010 4:29 AM CDT up reply actions
That is to say, I'd like to see him start WITHOUT AB BEING INJURED.
…Kinda sad that I feel the need to add that last bit…
by DribbleHooper on Jul 15, 2010 4:31 AM CDT up reply actions
The two of them made for a pretty good "small" lineup, when they were both on the floor.
Problem is, you need a 3rd PG for that, as they both expend a lot of energy.
Chase is looking pretty “point-forwardy” at this point though – nice handle, crisp, creative passes. With him out there you could have a really huge lineup up with Patterson going to the 3, Hill/Scola, Yao/Hill and Martin or Ariza manning the 2 but likely defending the PG. Maybe that’s a defensive nightmare, but in the right spot, could be nice.
"Each in turn... volunteered his suggestions, his invaluable suggestions."
It's Funny
Coming into summer league, I completely expected Jermaine Taylor to show his capability as a combo guard to increase his value, but instead the Rocket gave Jermaine the green light and groom Chase to run the offense on several occasions.
If we were auditioning a 3rd PG, Jermaine certainly wasnt part of that. (Ish Smith on the other hand can be a very viable 3rd point to stash on the D league)
Kyle LOWRY
the BOWLING BALL is back!!! Watch out, whoever is in the lane.
by bigalshouseoflove on Jul 15, 2010 3:32 PM CDT reply actions
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