How the Superstar Houston Needs Could Be Sitting Right in Front of Them
by Samarth Sulhan on May 21, 2011 11:22 PM CDT
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PrintNo I'm not talking about Kevin Martin. I love Kevin Martin and think he is the most efficient scorer in NBA history but I'm thinking of someone else. I'm talking about Terrence Williams.
Him being a superstar, though, would be dependent on one thing...putting him in lineups where he's playing the point gaurd position.
6 foot 6, great speed, great passing abilities, lockdown defender, good mid-range shot, unbeleivable athleticism, good basketball IQ, good handles, good rebounder. If I could build the most dominating point gaurd in the NBA, that sounds about right.
Best Case Scenario- Offensively Terrence is unstoppable. Teams can't put their sg's on him because Kevin Martin would eat up pg's. Terrence will play alot like Russel Westbrook, getting to the rim and pulling up at will. He will boast LeBron James like numbers, with his passing and rebounding skills. Defensively our backcourt defense will improve tremendously. It will give Kevin Martin the option to gaurd the pg while Terrence can gaurd the 2 and even the 3.
Worst Case Scenario- This sounds biased since I'm presenting this idea, but with Williams game defensively not being porous and offensively not being turnover-prone, this can't really end up turning out bad.
Having so much depth and talent, it allows us to do alot of crazy stuff, and I'm sure Daryl Morey is aware of this. Last year he traded what was the most-improved player from last year and our starting small forward for a backup pg and a player that barely played 5 minutes for us. People that didn't know alot about the rockets thought this would be a hugedrop off in our offense. It actually imroved our offense because of how Kyle Lowry and Chase Budinger stepped up.
The reason I'm bringing that up is because we could trade away Luis Scola and Kyle Lowry and improve drastically with T-Will and Patterson doing a better job and getting better players.
Here's a scenario in the draft: We trade Kyle Lowry, Dragic, Luis Scola and our 2 picks in the first to Minnesota. From there we select Derrick Williams or Enes Kanter.
Lineup-Pg- T-Will and Lee
Sg- Kevin Martin and Lee
sf- Derrick Williams, Budinger
pf- Patterson, Hill
C- Hayes, Thabeet
OR
Lineup-Pg- T-Will and Lee
Sg- Kevin Martin and Lee
sf- Chase Budinger
pf- Patterson, Hill
C- Enes Kanter, Hayes
Scenario #2- We do a sign and trade in the offseason for Marc Gasol, Nene, or DeAndre Jordan by trading away Kyle Lowry and Scola
A young, athletic linup that looked like this would be unbeleivable.
Lineup-Pg- T-Will and Lee
Sg- Kevin Martin and Lee
sf- Chase Budinger
pf- Patterson, Hill
C- (One of those 3 centers), Hayes
Having so much depth and skill located in certain positions and not in some allows us to make trades and ultimately have addition by subtraction.
I think this is the direction that Houston should go in, please comment on how this scenario would fare with our future success.
No cursing in title. No pirated material, such as links to online game streams. Do not cut/paste entire sections of content from other websites. Thanks.
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Putting all of your stock in a player who is so far unproven is a bad idea.
It’s not that I know that T-Will is bad. It’s that I don’t know that he’ll be “unstoppable”.
if he isn't unstoppable
he won’t be horrible and it can’t turn out bad because defensively hes fine and offensively he isn’t messy and we have Dragic who gives us stability at the pg position
thats why i think we should trade lowry, since his stock is high, for a higher draft pick or a sign and trade for a fa center…then t-will can step in
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:06 AM CDT up reply actions
Everybody is stoppable
I think he is a good player but his attitude has been poor but I think DM has more confidence in him than RA did. We shall see. The times he did play I was not impressed with his skills. He showed some spark but never caught fire
by mjdinhouston on May 22, 2011 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree
If Adelman had let TWill out of the doghouse last year (and I kept wishing he would have) we would have a better idea as to whether this is a viable idea.
But giving up Lowry, who emerged as one of the top PG’s in the West last year would be foolish IMHO. We don’t know if we have Derrick Rose hiding behind the curtain (TW) or Shaun Livingston.
Too much to risk to give up a good PG on an otherwise mediocre team.
sign and trade
i meant for a sign and trade
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:02 AM CDT up reply actions
that's some quality pot you've been smokin man
shop smart, shop S-mart.....YOU GOT THAT!
expand
on how ridiculous and outrageous my idea is
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:09 AM CDT up reply actions
That's an insult to pot smokers.
You’re average pot smoker wouldn’t have even bothered with such a proposal.
Instead, they’d start off by simply saying T-Will is awesome, and then wonder off rambling about the infinite conundrum between choosing a BBQ sandwich or Papa John’s pizza during half-time. Then brag about getting a customized #420 on their Rockets jersey, and ask why they front corner of the Toyota Center in front of the lower level practice court and Tundra parking always smells like marijuana (seriously, it really does always smell like marijuana there).
by Nobody is Better Than Jordan on May 24, 2011 5:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I already made a similar post
http://www.thedreamshake.com/2011/1/28/1961306/an-experiment-i-would-like-to-try-at-some-point
Me against the world is a mismatch in my favor.
sorry
but yeah it’s unlikely to happen if we dont trade away our point gaurd
the move could have alot of upside to it and i even saw a video where t-will said pg is the position he wants to play
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree with you
The problem is that you will soon be attacked by everyone on this board besides me, Boncrusher31, and BD34 (and maybe a few others) because we are the only ones who even want to give Williams a chance. T-Will is extremely talented and hungry but the worst thing that can happen to a player like that is getting buried on the bench. Hopefully Adelman has not stunted his growth and he breaks out next season and silences his critics. I think him playing PG is a very good idea but he is going to spend most of his time on the wings.
Me against the world is a mismatch in my favor.
I dont really like the way people talk about him
Like this post is abit mad to be honest! trading out 2 of our top players and placing the teams future on an unproven SF who want to play PG. Dont get me wrong i said it befor that he looks like a PG and got told im a idiot. I see huge upside him him IF he gets off twitter and starts playin team ball.
Potentially we could have a starter that can play PG, SG, SF, great defender, athletic and a strong scorer, BUT he aint gonna do that in a year or the next. He needs solid mins (+10 at least) he needs to learn from proven players in those positions. Putting him in on his own more or less is stupid no offense
bottom line he CAN b good, hes not gonna do it in a year, he cant come from gettin no mins to leadin a team and the trade would be a waste
by IrishThrasher on May 22, 2011 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions
a trade
could provide us with a quiality center…
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah but not the way this post said it
outta curiosuty who would u like to get at center? not who could we get
by IrishThrasher on May 23, 2011 7:59 AM CDT up reply actions
People blame T-Mac for not making the most of his talents. T-Mac was a top 5 player in the league.
Terrence Williams doesn’t make the most of his talents.
Can't do that on the bench
Me against the world is a mismatch in my favor.
by batman713 on May 22, 2011 1:54 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
That's not what Eddy Curry said.
DAMNNN!!
I'm a household name... at my house.
by taylorrohrman on May 22, 2011 2:13 AM CDT up reply actions
Honestly, I love the idea of Williams in the lineup but I feel like at the 2 or the 3 he's best utilized.
We have a great distributor in Lowry, a great scorer in Martin, and Williams clearly can strike to take that starting spot from C-Buddy or whoever we draft there (Almost guaranteeing a SF). McGrady had that Point-Forward role for us and I think if Williams works on his three point shot he’d be a deadly player as it comes together. I think his talents are entirely unique and that he’ll be able to translate them so long as the guy in charge of his minutes isn’t going to punish him for being talented.
I would enjoy keeping our position of strength in the PG and SG and work Williams into that strong three role. Ship Scola out, bump Patterson up in a Patterson/Hill/Hayes at the 4, start Thabeet and go Hasheem/Hill/Miller. Everyone gets plenty of minutes, healthy blend on the floor, working on youth (Since Martin is expendable in year 2 of the rebuild…).
Kudos for sparking this discussion in an offseason where we just have a lockout hanging over our heads. If the NFL is any model I think we can all agree with Bender’s great words of “We’re boned.”
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
the reason i feel lowry is expandable
is cause of how dragic did at the end of the year last year (triple doubles) and how t-will could slowly become a really good point gaurd
if we dealt lowry and scola out of positions where we could be well off without them (pg and pf) and get a quality center in return, also allowing us to move hayes to the 4, it would bolster up our lineup and i think we would be a better team
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Here's where we fundamentally differ.
If we ship out Lowry we’re giving Dragic the job on a limited window. I think he could be a starting point but not right yet. Ariza netted a triple double last year in the last game of the season too but this board still thinks he was a POS.
We need to trade from strength, not trade into weakness. Lee can cover the 1 and the 2, not the 1, 2, and 3. Williams can play 1 through three. We have one three on the roster, ahead of Williams, two shooting guards in front of him, and two point guards. Why jettison one of the point guards and weaken out the SF position? It’s likely we won’t be retaining Bud if we draft a SF in the lottery this year.
When it comes to a quality center, what good is the quality center if you start stripping guys who could come in and do the most with him right off the bat? We’re taking a pretty stark youth movement and have Hill and Thabeet on our roster, we’re most likely not going to try to turn right around and contend instantly, so I don’t think the idea of “trading for a quality center” is high on the list, it’s more “Develop our potential centers this season.”
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
like you said
t-will can play the point and the 3 so trading out one of the pg’s wont weaken the sf position considering that…a center i would like is a young and athletic DeAndre Jordan (or Enes Kanter) and Thabeet would play behind him…from there the 4 would have Patterson and Hill and Hayes would most likely play both the 4 and the 5 instead of Hill
A lineup like this pg Dragic, T-Will (Lee)
sg- Martin, Lee
sf-Budinger, T-Will (maybe a rookie like Chris Singleton)
pf- Patterson, Hill, Hayes
c-DeAndre Jordan (or maybe Enes Kanter), Thabeet, Hayes
To me that doesn’t look like we’re trading into weaknesses but into a potential really good lineup and a lineup better defensively then we have now.
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions
DeAndre Jordan is almost guaranteed to be back in LA since he was a big part of their resurgence with Griffin, Bledsoe, and Gordon.
What you are proposing is stretching the lineup thin to give the illusion of depth where one injury will really put the spurs to the lineup. You have Lee offering depth in two positions, one as the primary backup and Williams doing double duty to create faux depth at the 1.
We’re not landing a young franchise style center and we’re most likely working with Thabeet and Hill at the 5 with Hill doing the flex dance between 4 and 5. It makes sense, it gives us options, and at the end of the day, let’s take it since it is a smart thing to do. Even if we draft a SF Bud is likely gone because he improved on defense but improving from 0 isn’t difficult. He’s pretty good offensively but unless he learns to put the clamps on D he’s not worth it when you have a better player needing time behind him.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
DeAndre Jordan
he’s from Houston and he’s been quoted saying that it was a dream for him to play for the Rockets…The Clippers also have Kaman so it’s not an absolute neccesity that they retain him
And if we wanted Kanter we could trade Lowry and Scola and our 2 picks for Clevelands #4…This would Cleveland the flexibilitty to take Derrick Williams with the #1 if they aren’t sold on Irving and Minnesota would take Kyrie and then Utah allready has enough frontcourt depth…so then we could take Kanter at 4.
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions
The Clippers have also openly stated they're going to match whatever offer he receives.
Sucks to be him that his team has the right of first refusal to match any contract he’s offered. It depends on what happens with the new CBA anyhow but I hate to burst your bubble but there’s lots of guys with a Houston connection that aren’t coming to play here anytime soon.
Also, you’re assuming that Cleveland wants that trade. As I said in another thread, it’s two later draft picks in a bad draft with a breaking player on a backloaded contract (so it gets worse as he ages) for a top 5 pick? Good luck selling them on that one.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
..
Do you think that the Clippers would still keep him even if we offered a sign and trade where we gave them Lowry and Scola?
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 2:49 PM CDT up reply actions
why would they consider taking on Scola
when Blake is going to get 33-35 mpg. That’s a hefty salary for a back-up aging PF.
Funny how Memphis' ****-up has become Houston's obsession
Yes, I do, because they've got better players at those positions in Bledsoe and Griffin.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
Griffin is better than Scola, and its ridiculous to think LA would want him, but don’t be an anti-homer and claim that Bledsoe is better than Lowry.
by seanbergmanrules on May 22, 2011 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions
He will be there easily.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
He’s a turnover aficionado. He could improve, but that’s been a knock against him since as long as people have paid attention, and its a little presumptuous to assume he’ll overcome it.
by seanbergmanrules on May 23, 2011 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions
They haven't said that
They said that bringing him back will be a “priority” but they haven’t said absolutely that they’re matching any offers…
by Patrick Harrel on May 22, 2011 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions
So by priority they mean "plan to ditch him if another offer comes up."
or by priority they mean there’s not much that can be done to get him? Ambiguity goes both ways.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
the clippers organuzation is so poorly run
That nothing would surprise me at this point. Whatever they try to pull I guarentee you blake is leaving as soon as he can. Wouldn’t you?
They just traded davis for williams wich was at best a wash and cost them a no.1 overall pick in the process. Let’s not forget that blake had a hard-on for davis as well.
They were real buddy-buddy and he had to hear his owner use his court-side seats to heckle his friend. There is a clippers curse and his name is donald sterling.
"Never underestimate the heart of a champion"- Rudy T, all up in that azz
by ShookednShanghaied11 on May 22, 2011 7:52 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
and that by the way
Was the super secret correct way of spelling ‘organization’
"Never underestimate the heart of a champion"- Rudy T, all up in that azz
by ShookednShanghaied11 on May 22, 2011 7:53 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
They may be a historically bad franchise but even fuck ups get it right once in a while.
Add to it that he’s still in LA and I think you just diminished more of the point you were trying to make. Trading Baron Davis won’t deter Griffin from sticking with a group that is built around him and enforced by some talented youngsters.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
and also
why do people think so lowly of Budinger…I think he could end up being really good…
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions
After a bad start to the year
Bud improved. Before the Battier trade he started to penetrate more and be more agressive, instead of just jacking up a shot. The problem is Martin is great on offense, and average on d, Bud is also average on d. Bud has two guard height and size, but he can’t guard two guards. We need a taller,longer more defensive minded three, to help cover for Martin’s average d. And also for when we play the Bron,Pierce,Durant,Gay and the other more physical threes. Also when we play teams with great scoring two’s we can let him guard them and let Martin switch to guardng the three or something. If we don’t get the defensive center we also need, it will just magnify the need for another three.
by since86rocketsfan on May 22, 2011 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions
I can't be on this bandwagon
This is puting too much faith in T-Will, who is nowhere near a guarantee for playing anywhere near a superstar mode. He should be a second option coming off the bench, not starting. He wants starter minutes? He needs to earn them. I have hope in the guy, but none more than Hill or Thabeet. All of those are guys who I do not expect to pan out to anything great, and will be pleasantly surprised if they do achieve considerable success. Pat-Pat is where my hope is.
"You know how Einstein got bad grades as a kid? Well, mine are
even worse! " ~Bill Watterson, Calvin and Hobbes
by TheChuckwagonisrolling on May 22, 2011 7:49 AM CDT reply actions
You're holding it against certain guys that Adelman didn't give much of a chance to or didn't give a consistent chance to show what they have.
When it comes to Williams I don’t think there can be any doubt that something was going on behind the scenes and it wasn’t basketball related. Let’s run down the checklist of what Williams has done and show:
1.) Ability to average astronomical stats in the D-League? Check. Triple Double AVERAGE.
2.) Athleticism? Shown it in his limited time on the NBA Court.
3.) Fantastic court vision? Shown it in his limited playing time (First two appearances in which his team mates cost him easily 5 assists).
4.) An attitude problem? Certainly, but you’d be upset to if you were caged while your team was doing poorly. Apparently to Adelman if the ship is sinking you press for more of what you’ve been doing rather than change it at all.
5.) Ability to get to the basket? A few times in his limited minutes.
At the end of the day when we look at our roster, Adelman got a lot out of the guys he wanted, those he didn’t want to give a chance to look worse by comparison because he shat on their options. It’s begrudging to hold Rick’s transgressions against a guy’s ability. I’m a Jordan Hill believer and I think he struggled but at the end of the day he was in the midst of a major positional change.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
I'm not holding anything against him. Im fully aware of how Adelman pissed on him,
and was highly dissapointed for him for doing so. The guy definately deserves a chance. However, I do not see this potential superstar you guys see. Sure, it’s a possibility, but I have not seen enough to warrant this awesome love everyone is giving him. I saw strong court vision, a good ability to get to the basket, above-average atheleticism, and shitty fundamentals. I see a skilled player in him, but not a superstar. I just don’t get how people have seen the little they have of him and have such high hopes from such a tiny sample size.
"You know how Einstein got bad grades as a kid? Well, mine are
even worse! " ~Bill Watterson, Calvin and Hobbes
by TheChuckwagonisrolling on May 22, 2011 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
I think everyone's hope in T-Will is because he honestly has the highest ceiling of any player on the team, maybe including Patterson.
We have to see how Patterson plays next year in a much increased role.
Same thing goes for T-Will, as I imagine he’ll get some heavy playing time in Pre-Season, assuming that we have it.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 22, 2011 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions
patterson wont get that "much increased role"
if scola isn’t traded…scola needs to get traded, even if it’s just for draft picks next year
i think scola can carry this offense like scola did and will only get better, not to mention he’s way better defensively than scola
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not sure about this.
As much as I love T-Will, he’s unproven.
Would I like for him to start? Sure. But he didn’t exactly play well last year, when given time. He had some good moments where he wasn’t lazy and decided to drive to the hoop. That’s when he’s at his best, driving to the hoop. Unfortunately, he settles for jumpers more times than not. Now, his jumper will eventually improve, but he has to realize it’s not his strength right now. He’s so athletic that if he drives to the basket, he’ll either get the bucket or get fouled.
As for the trade, I would not do it. Drafting DW would put T-Will farther down in the depth chart, and Kanter is a guy who we do not need.
I’m starting to warm up to Biyombo, just because he’s already ready to contribute on the defensive end of the court. I’m not saying he’s ready to start, but I think he’ll come in and be a high energy guy off the bench at first. His defensive fundamentals are sound enough to get him maybe 20 minutes a game. Besides throwing down some nice dunks, he doesn’t do anything else on offense, so he could be a liability.
Biyombo is the only player I’d trade up for in this draft. I wouldn’t mind trading Scola and our two first rounders to get the guy. Patterson is ready to be a starter, and Biyombo would come off the bench. Besides, we only have one or two roster spots, so we couldn’t afford to keep all of our draft picks. It’d be best to trade them for Biyombo or for future picks.
I think T-Will’s most realistic chance of being a contributor on this team is if he’s aggressive. If the lockout would end by training camp, he needs to show the new coach that he can be a dynamic player, which he can be.
Superstar? I don’t know about that. All-Star? Possibly.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
If Biyombo is going to come off the bench,
who’s going to be the starting C when the season starts? If you want to trade 2 first rounders and Scola for a guy, don’t you think it should be for someone starter worthy? I know we don’t agree on what Houston should do in the draft, but it’s pretty deep at the 3, and there’s a couple guys who might be there at 14 who will shortly be better than Bud.
Funny how Memphis' ****-up has become Houston's obsession
2 first rounders in a horrible draft and an aging power forward with a knee problem and a backloaded contract.
Does that sound like starter caliber trade to you?
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
shit yeah it does......
Daryl has made this draft his baby, we all know this. Not just acquiring the picks, but the un-willingness to part ways with them (Mareese Speights but I’m not going to get into that). I’m all about packaging picks and Scola and moving up. But that’s only for about 5 players. IMO there’s a couple point guards and small forwards(one overseas) I would love to move up for, and I think they have the ability to be franchise players. I love the idea, just not Biyombo. He can become a rim monster no doubt, but there’s still a lot un-known. I would package and move up for something more proven, but that’s just me. And even if we can’t move up, I still think there’s great value at 14 at a position we need, the SF.
Funny how Memphis' ****-up has become Houston's obsession
I like the concept of this draft as his baby. I would say Daryl is a genetic jackhammer though because he has put together some stuff for next year too.
A few 2nd rounders in 2014 as well too. I disagree with the franchise player estimate in here, I think they’re all those second tier complimentary guys. Kind of like Joe Johnson. Certainly not franchise but your franchise would hurt without them, you know what I mean? Rough-shod equivalent of Kevin Martins.
I’m in total agreement on the Small Forward being the richest part of this draft and I think it’s our most likely course of action. As far as trading to get up, I think a backloaded contract for a vet with knee injury concerns plus two eh, to mediocre picks isn’t going to get us top 5 if teams see franchise players up where you do. If teams see the draft as I do, I think we can get it. Maybe we’re both right and we can easily use that trade and snag a franchise player.
Can we get back to insulting each other? This agreeing and having good exchanges of views thing has GOT to make people think we entered bizzaro world.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
We would have to settle with Chuck starting.
This would be the last year though. Hopefully, Thabeet will be ready to contribute this year, and maybe even start next year. All depends on what he shows on the court.
Hell, Biyombo has the ability to play center, if needed. He’s a strong guy at 6’9" 240, and he has his well known wingspan of 7’7", that will help considerably on bigger players.
Again, I sound like I’m throwing in Biyombo right off the bat, but I’m not. I would like for him to come off the bench first and get his feet wet. If he shows that he can successfully play defense at the NBA level, bump his minutes up, and then if he continues to improve, start him.
It’s a long process, and we haven’t even had the draft yet, so this is all hypothetical. However, it is realistic, because Morey is going to move up in the draft, likely to Sacramento, and my guess is that he would target Biyombo.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 22, 2011 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions
You're right, it's all hypothetical....
but now you mention Chuck and it’s like we’re packaging 2 first rounders, an aging PF yet still productive, and using free agent money. That to me seems like a whole lot of sacrificing just to have Miller, Thabeet, Biyombo, and Chuck as you mentioned at C. It’s not going to be easy to figure out the C problem, but IMO that’s too much and the position still doesn’t seemed solved to me.
If Biyombo was an absolute can’t miss, it can be justified. I just think he’s too much of an un-known to give all that up.
Funny how Memphis' ****-up has become Houston's obsession
The problem is can't miss centers are extremely rare. Seven foot people, let alone athletic ones, are extremely rare.
It’s a position you have to take chances on unless you are lucky enough to have a number one pick when a Dwight Howard, Yao (foot problems aside), Duncan, Shaq, David Robinson, Ewing or Olajuwon enters the draft.
I agree we need to clear the position out but it shouldn’t be too hard to get rid of Miller, he’s got a great contract (partially guaranteed next year, like the Dampier one) and Chuck’s a free agent.
that's true you are more than likely going to have to take a chance...
but just go back to last year. Cousins and Favors athough maybe not true centers, were polished NBA ready big men. And both were impact players in their rookie season. You kind of had an idea what you’re going to get without the initial character issues from Cousins. There’s not one of those type prospects in this draft, let alone moving up for.
Funny how Memphis' ****-up has become Houston's obsession
I think Biyombo compares well to Favors (athletic big man) and Kanter compares well to Cousins (wide, back to basket low post big man).
Since neither of those guys played college, I see how they are more risky than Cousins and Favors. Add in a trade up and it may be too risky. I guess it all depends on how much you trust your scouts and what kind of deal you can get.
Looking ahead to the 2012 draft, I don’t see a great center class, though.
I’m not saying center is the right course, but dismissing it because of the current roster isn’t the right course either.
He lookd like sa good player but..
hes not got exp if we trade out 2points where is he gonna learn? i no its prob not that big a deal but i think havin such a young team with no vocal leaders and vets would hurt the teams young players. Battier does so much more for a team then his box score for example.
point im tryin to make is he will be changing position which can b hard for players, he will b our only point (lee can fill i at times but he is not a PG), its to big a gamble not only on an unproven player but also losin a great player in Lowry.
I don't think T-Will needs to become a superstar....
and don’t get me confused with HT, I’m not a T-Will hater. I just always thought he was given a raw deal, and on the wrong end of a numbers game. But getting back to the point, does he really need to be a team stat leader to be impactufl? I don’t think so at all. You watch the WCF, and how about James Harden. What are T-Will’s best attributes right now? I would say his court vision and ability to distribute more so than his jumper. James Harden comes in off the bench and is great off the dribbe, he can give limited offensive players like Collison and Mohommed easy layups with his ability to penetrate and dish. Harden can also hit a 3, but is streaky. Not a great defender, but can and is getting better. I think right now, T-WIll can come in and have an impact off the bench when Lowry is out and just distrubute, make his teammates better. I mean Scola is money with the 15-18 ft baseline jumper and if Houston has a guy who can get into the paint at will (no pun) that should be there all day. Terrence’s shot and defense would develop with more play. But to say that we have an all-star with LeBron-type ability on the bench is a bit of a stretch.
Funny how Memphis' ****-up has become Houston's obsession
twill has potential , but settles for threes which he isnt good at and avoids contact, immature as well
plus kevin martin is starter, he would need starters minutes to develop
T-Will has the tools to easily be an Iggy-type of wing, so why move him to pg?
Does he want to defend quicker, lighter guys for a whole game? He’s pretty big to be chasing Aaron Brooks around for 40 minutes and wasting energy bringing the ball up.
Playing without the ball is one of his weaknesses and playing pg would seemingly help this, but good wings can have usage stats higher than pgs.
I think just giving T-Will at least 20 minutes per game next season would do wonders for him.
As it would for Thabeet.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
It all depends on TWill.
20 minutes a night of improving his craft = 2013 all-star
20 minutes of and1 mixtape = 2013 out of the league
Completely agree.
As long as he takes god shots, and doesn’t force it.
I think he’ll be fine, though. He’s comfortable playing with everyone else now, so that should help.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 22, 2011 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
If he takes "god" shots
His field goal % would be T 100.
Me against the world is a mismatch in my favor.
hopefully
thats why morey fired adelman…ill be pretty pissed if i dont see them getting there minutes next season
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Putting aside everything about his attitude
and ignoring the fact that he hasn’t been able to get along with a couple of coaches, and his inconsistent play….using his name and “superstar” in the same sentence is a huge stretch. With his passing ability and athletic ability, this guy could be a starter or a key role player. An All Star though? Or a superstar? Let’s see if he can play consistently for about 25 minutes a game before we anoint him as a superstar. To me that’s part of his problem. He thinks he’s better than he is, not realizing how great everyone in the NBA really is. You have to show it every time you step on the court. In practice, working out, working with assistant coaches, and most importantly in games. I too hope to see him get minutes next season, and start to work his way to becoming a solid NBA player.
by twinkilling0303 on May 22, 2011 1:28 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
BTW
this is said with no malice or frustration, just my opinion. If he does turn into one though, would help the club out a lot. It’s just too far down the road to tell.
by twinkilling0303 on May 22, 2011 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions
Let’s see if he can play consistently for about 25 minutes a game before we anoint him as a superstar. To me that’s part of his problem. He thinks he’s better than he is, not realizing how great everyone in the NBA really is.
He averaged 22 minutes for 78 games as a rookie and the Nets board had a reaction similar to this when he left. Obvious talent questionable mind set.
T Will deserves a some playing time
to prove what we all think he is capable of. Making good passes, good defense, and alot of above the rim play. With Lowry playing at an similiar Allstar level after his early injury its no way you trade him. If he comes back this year and plays like he did last year he already will surpass his current contract, meaning being worth more then five mill a year. Now with Patterson being far more superior on defense then Scola, and his great shot, physical inside play, and still being on his rookie contract, could get Scola moved. I do think patterson needs to play well this year as well as Lowry to be considered legit, but think if Pat gets the same amount of shots Scola got he can put up those numbers.
by since86rocketsfan on May 22, 2011 1:32 PM CDT reply actions
LOL
Good thing we’re anonymous here, I’ve been harsh on TWill before and I’m pretty sure he could beat my ass down.
Your welcome.
I tweeted it to him.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 22, 2011 9:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Im sorry what???/
First its been said above but you want to trade away the two best players on the team for
a rookie who might not even work out at center
and a sf who wants to be a pg.
There have been about a billion super athletic players with some decent skills – not all of them work out.
When we traded for Jordan Hill everyone acted as if we had found a guy who would anchor the position for years. How’s that working out?
Yi Jian is a legit 7 foot chineese man. Picked 6th in the draft. People are still waiting for Yi to become Yao. I think they stopped holding their breath a long time ago.
I dont understand this mad rush everyone has to appoint twill as the next lebron james. Seriously, people around here act as if we’ve had kobe bryant on the bench this entire last year and Rick decided to bench him just for kicks and giggles. I understand that Twill needs some time to “develop” and to get some playing time and consistent minutes, but can we please stop acting as if he is the guaranteed next big thing? He isnt. He is all potential and he hasn’t shown that he has what it takes between the ears to realize that potential. Before BD and Bat and some of you other jump on me he could have it, but please stop acting like he does for sure. And yes thats what you have been doing, because the second anyone says anything bad about Either Twill or HT you jump on them.
For every Dwight Howard there is out there – you can find a Kwame Brown, a Darko Milicic, Yi
For every Carmelo Anthony there is out there – you can find a Stromile Swift, Adam Morrison, Kendrik Brown.
Being an NBA player is hard. It takes more than just talent. Sometimes even the most athletic and talented players just dont have what it takes. I await watching Twill and Hasheem Thabeet make me eat the most delicious crow in the world.
yi jianlian and all those other "busts"
got there minutes and chances to prove themselves…t-will and thabeet haven’t yet
by Samarth Sulhan on May 22, 2011 6:34 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Do you really honestly think they have not??
HT got as much playing time in memphis as Darko got.
Thabeet saw what, 10 minutes a game or so, no developmental coaching, and a horrible Memphis team.
Williams saw how many minutes, did pretty well, then got sent to the D-League cause Avery Johnson is a known asshole?
But yea, Jianlian’s being drafted to be a major player in Milwaukee, failing out and coming to New Jersey to flare out, then his exile to Washington DC where he’s having trouble cracking the rotation after three stops, plenty of attention, and opportunity is clearly equivalent to Williams getting his opportunities cut short and Thabeet being thrown onto the s*itheap that is (or was, rather) Memphis.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
I think this is the reason Morey traded for him in the first place
And I also think this will weigh in on which coach Morey and Alexander finally agree on
If you're a fan of basketball, watch a movie called Sonicsgate. It's free, just google it.
The fact that he's got talent to become a star
The whole PG move depends on how he factors out at the 2 or even the 3 spots.
If you're a fan of basketball, watch a movie called Sonicsgate. It's free, just google it.
Once freed from Rick's Dungeon
Will Mr Williams take it as a green light to jack up every shot he can,or has he finally learned playing a team game will get him all the minutes he wants?
A Freed-Willy jacker,no thanks.
A multi-talented player willing to defend,set up his teammates and able to take over during crucial stretches,a wet dream indeed.
I hope,but have my doubts.
I think a very accurate preview of TWill at pg would be Tyreke Evans.
Same size, similar game (except TWill seems to penetrate to set up the pass rather than the shot like Evans).
Why trade Lowry?
When you can utilize him in multiple guard sets. I could see playing T-Will at point and Lowry as the off guard. Its been done with aaron brooks and it wouldn’t hurt us defensively. Plus, while it still isn’t a complete weapon Lowry is getting better at shooting the three, which improves his value at the 2 spot. Just a suggestion, I’m all for trading Scola. I just think Lowry is versatile enough to hold on to.
by clutchcitywillreturn on May 22, 2011 4:50 PM CDT reply actions
The main thing is we
dont want to create another hole by trying to fix a hole. Meaning you dont trade Lowry after the solid year he had, to get a center or three, just to now be forced to try to find someone to replace Lowry. With Martin and Lee i dont see the need for Lowry playing much two, unless thre is foul trouble, or a team is playing really small. Lee has proved he deserves his minutes.
by since86rocketsfan on May 22, 2011 5:33 PM CDT reply actions
TWill is as far from superstardom as Thabeet is from being beast on defense
What skill does he have at even star level?
Shooting? Way below average.
Ability to create his own shot? Well, low percentage ones.
Passing? Above average, and definitely his best skill at the moment
Rebounding? Okay, although not really a big deal either way.
Defense? Inconsistent
Mental makeup? Full of himself
Decision Making? Way below average
TWill can be a superstar, but I’m putting the odds at about 0.01%.
Harsh evaluation from a guy who fared well his rookie season, savaged the D-League, and came to Houston for Adelman to spit on him.
As for superstardom qualities you’re looking for
Shooting? Get Lebron in the mid-range and he’s not threatening at all.
Ability to create his own shot? Williams hasn’t had the opportunity to do so.
Passing? He’s a very strong passer.
Rebounding? Don’t write off rebounding, especially not on this team.
Defense? Give him more than garbage minutes and then evaluate it.
Mental makeup? I recall some douchenozzle taking an hour long program to take a dump on an entire city, but that guy isn’t full of himself or a superstar, right?
Decision making? In spot minutes of a disenfranchised player the decision making will look poor, or his threading the needle to get passes to his team mates and their inability to catch or convert will cause a guy to lose faith in his squad, either one.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
by BD34 on May 23, 2011 7:22 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Nothing you said actually implies he's destined for stardom
If we’re purely talking about potential. The Rockets have been filled with them over the past years: Gerald Green, Jordan Hill, Hasheem Thabeet, Donte Green, and I’m sure I’m missing a lot of others. I just don’t find Williams to have somehow separated himself as more of a sure thing than any other long-shot prospect the Rockets have had over the past years.
Btw, let’s not compare a 12th man off the bench with one of the best players in the entire NBA when it comes to being a diva. That’s like saying it’s okay for some McDonalds worker to have an attitude because you see it in billionaires all the time. If Terrence Williams can do what Lebron does on the court, I wont’ care if have his weekly TV show about how awesome he is.
Gerald Green was cut for lack of ability to learn anything other than dunk.
Jordan Hill had a positional change and had to re-live his rookie year and still showed up strong. Thabeet hasn’t gotten a chance, Donte Green was traded for Ron Artest, and I’m sure the “list of others” will more resemble Thabeet and Donte’s case rather than the other two.
Also, why is it ok for you to call character into question based on attitude but when it’s shown to be wrong it’s not ok for me to refute it? You said his attitude keeps him from being a superstar, I four-upped you with an even bigger egotistical maniac and now, all of a sudden, I can’t do that? It’s DIRECTLY related to what you brought up, unlike your McDonald’s example. Sometimes you just have to admit the other guy got you rather than pick up your football and proudly proclaim “I win because it’s my football.” when you’re down 46-0 you didn’t win.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
There's a difference between being full of yourself on the court and off the court
When you’re not a star on the court yet but pretend you are, you stop yourself from improving on your game to reach your full potential. And you would never shoulder any blame because all setbacks are due to other people and their failings.
When you are a star on the court and pretend like you’re supremely relevant even off the court, you may be full of yourself. But it still doesn’t change the fact that you’re a star on the court.
I’m okay with the latter, not the former.
I really think you're way off base in that evaluation.
Williams has some swagger and an attitude. It’s a good thing. Is that costing him working on his game? Definitely not. You can have attitude and not compromise work ethic, he’s got some swagger, so what? He wasn’t given a chance to see the floor in Houston, that wasn’t because he can’t play the game. You don’t get picked 11th in the lottery without some skill. He didn’t see the floor because Adelman’s not a guy who plays season acquisition youth unless he’s forced to.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
He won't even do it when he's forced to
Remember the GS game when we were up 20 with two minutes left and he put in Demare Carrol before Williams? Then that night I ranted about it and the shit storm began.
Me against the world is a mismatch in my favor.
I still remember 30 point leads with the starters in and no inclination to remove them.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
Hmmm.... This isn't accurate
Shooting- Average at best, for now. If Shannon Brown and Kyle Lowry can develop jumpers, so can T-Will.
Ability to create his own shot- In time, he’ll be able to consistently make the 17 and 18 footers. And besides, when he drives to the basket, he’s nearly unstoppable.
Passing- Way above average, as is his court vision.
Rebounding- Above average. He gets way up there to get boards.
Defense- Not that inconsistent. He definitely has the ability to make himself into a lockdown defender.
Mental Makeup- Yeah, he is cocky, but he’s not selfish. He said in an interview that his favorite thing to do is rack up assists.
Decision Making- Not below average at all. It’s average, for now. Again, it’s another thing he will develop in time.
Your whole view is quite pessimist. For a guy who saw no time last year, you are awfully harsh on him.
Like it or not, T-Will is the one player we have who can become a superstar. You just have to have patience.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 23, 2011 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions
Well, I guess we have to agree to disagree.
I personally look at his incredibly below average stats in all the areas you mentioned(jumpers, inside shots, foul drawing), but I guess it’s always possible to interpret anything in any way if you wish. Whatever, no need to talk about “accuracy” when you can always place the blame on coaching for Williams’ lack of production so far.
Also, I didn’t say he can’t be a superstar. I simply implied that he’s “far” from being a superstar. If you want me to be more clear in my comparison, I feel the odds of Williams become the next superstar to be about the same as Thabeet becoming the next Mutumbo/Camby/Ben Wallace type. A lot of players can become superstars, ala Gerald Green. Doesn’t mean if you keep such a player, he’ll turn out to be one.
Only on TDS can you take what amounts to no sample size and translate that into a condemnation of a player who wasn't given a chance.
Agreeing to disagree in this case seems more like “I’m firing off pure opinion with no basis.”
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
by BD34 on May 23, 2011 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Assuming you are correct that no stat so far can be considered relevant...
…then isn’t it impossible to disprove what I just said as “inaccurate”?
I mean, if you want to argue that we simply don’t know anything about Williams as a player, I can understand that. I can almost agree with that. But if you want to say he’s has a great jumper, can finish around the basket as well as anyone, great defender, incredible passer, can play great defense, etc. without any proof, why can’t someone say the exact opposite and still claim validity?
When you have strong feelings towards T-Will
and feel he’s all the shiz he’s cracked up to be, you’re almost implying that you know more about basketball than Avery Johnson and Rick Adelman. No one knows, for all we know in practice he bricks jumpers and does behind the back passes out of bounds. I’m all about giving him more of an opportunity, but let’s not go overboard and assume he’s a game changer star.
Funny how Memphis' ****-up has become Houston's obsession
No one is implying they know more than Johnson or Adelman. They're looking at the situation as a whole.
Avery Johnson is a notoriously stubborn and hard-headed coach, this is why he could get Dallas to post its best record ever and lead them to the Finals and got fired. Adelman doesn’t play youth willingly, it’s why he got fired in Sacramento. Everyone here just gives the benefit of the doubt to the coach as some altruistic and omniscient genius and uses that to assume that people think they know better than the coach. You have to evaluate EVERYTHING about the coach.
Williams has all the tools in his kit to be a game changing star but you certainly can’t get those tools out and use them if you’re glued to the bench. I don’t think they count that if Williams hucks the ball in for an assist from the sideline.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
Like Woj said
We Nets fans have to thank AJ for atrocious signings like Travis Outlaw at $7M oer fir 5 years… Woj reported this year that very few people around the league trust AJ and that even fewer wanted to hire him as a coach.
You're looking at stats from a criminally small sample size in Houston.
If you play 30 seconds a month, take one shot, and miss it, you’re a 0% FG shooter. Do you think you will NEVER hit a shot?
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
by BD34 on May 23, 2011 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
If you shoot once and make it
does that make you a 100% FG shooter?
The small sample size argument can easily be turned around on you.
How can you appoint a guy the next Lebron on that small a sample size?
Especially when that sample size hasn’t been filled with really all that great play.
If you're going to make points that don't refute anything and conjure up arguments, then don't let me stop your fun but...
I never called him the next Lebron. Yes, if you play 30 seconds and hit your one shot you ARE a 100% FG shooter but I won’t be the idiot the tries to say he never misses a shot. I will look at the sample size and say “We can’t really say much about it, we can really only judge the play style and the situation, not the performance.”
So, continue to make up a discussion, just thought I’d clarify it’s almost all your creation, and not my participation.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
T-Will can reach an Igoudala level pretty easily based on his physical abilities.
Shooting? Way below average.
Ability to create his own shot? Well, low percentage ones.
Igoudala has a place in the league despite these same weaknesses.
Defense? Inconsistent
Mental makeup? Full of himself
Decision Making? Way below average
This is where he needs improvement. A 180 here would almost instantly make him Iggy-lite, little offense, but a defensive monster on the wing who can keep defenses honest with his penetration rather than shot.
Do I think that 180 will happen? Not really.
Do I think Iggy is a superstar? Not even close, but he’s got a niche that makes him valuable.
These are mostly second-hand opinions from Nets fans that had about 2000 minutes to evaluate T-Will.
Iggy is actually close to a superstar.
He has everything but a shot.
He’s a jumper away from being a superstar.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 23, 2011 9:26 PM CDT up reply actions
umm....
Haven’t been at TDS for a while and I in fact saw this post after T-Will retweeted it.
So I’m with a decent chunk of people who disagree that we should be trading Lowry away. I know, Lowry is due for a fail-year after he got sent to the draft lottery, but perhaps we will somehow end the curse. Scola, I’m all for trading up for.
Williams has always appeared to be this enigma that I hope pans out. But thrusting him into a starting PG role (or backup, if Dragic gets to start in this hypothetical scenario) would seem like the silliest idea, especially given that the off-season/pre-season training camps are going to be curtailed by the lockout and the fact that we have a new coach. Even if the new coach completely overhauls the offense, the starters have got used to playing with Lowry as the floor general and it won’t help the transition into a new offense if they are now dealing with a new PG.
As for Williams, he has shown glimpses but I’d guard against getting too excited. His D-League stats have been brought up a few times—keep in mind the sample size was 3 games and all three games were against teams that did not qualify to the playoffs. Not to mention that his team lost 2 of the 3 games despite his performance. Also, looking at those games, he was operating very much in the Carmelo Anthony/Kobe Bryant school of volume offense. He took 68 shots in those three games—shots he would certainly not be getting in an NBA offense. I wouldn’t read too much into the fact that he enraptured the D-League for about 4 days.
That said, I’m hopefully that he will get extended minutes this season (or just any minutes, really). He could be a key part of our defensive efforts against the SGs and SFs that routinely destroy the Rockets.
click here for: nba playoffs 2010-11 predictions
by sohum on May 23, 2011 10:26 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Oh noes.
A realistic view of his skillz.
No ways bro. Twill is going to put up a triple double for the Rocketz because he just absolutely dominated the D league.
He can shoot 100% from half court with hiz eys closed.
He is the greatest defender in teh Worldz!
His passing is teh amazingness. DId you see that full court pass? Proves to me hes got the stuff.
Hard work in the gym? Approaching the game with the right mindset?
Earning your minutes. Well fux dat. Hes like Lebron James. He dont even have to show up to practice. He still our superstar.
*Facepalm*
Herein lies why the discourse gets heated, repetitive, and shallow because people are more than happy to belittle and mock anything they disagree with. There hasn’t been an inflated appraisal of anyone’s abilities in this thread yet you decide to go ahead and post something meant to be inflammatory. If you’re going to bait people out don’t be such a child about it, please.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
by BD34 on May 23, 2011 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
+1
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 23, 2011 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Because we never had it.
We have the right to swap picks with the Knicks this year, which we will most likely not exercise. Next year we get the Knick’s pick, lottery protected to the top 5 I believe.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
ok i was wondering how that worked out.
so if knicks get a 6th next year it will be our pick? not holding my breath i am just saying. so those picks have become pretty pointless in a sense?
Not really.
We are pretty much guaranteed that top 5 protected pick.
No way the Knicks don’t make the playoffs. ‘Melo and Amar’e do not play well together, but the East is just so damn weak.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 23, 2011 9:28 PM CDT up reply actions
basically
we could be in the same spots in the draft next year that we are this year.
"Stability is a factor in teams that win the championship. But if you stabilize on a team that's going to end up short of that, then all you're doing is spinning your wheels in the 45-win range."-----Daryl Morey
by fanoflosingteams on May 24, 2011 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions
Calculated risk
We lose ours but if we make the playoffs we’ll most likely have a better record than the Knicks (Again) which leaves us with a better first pick position anyhow.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
We aren't going to make the playoffs.
Or it’s not likely that we do.
We are probably going to have the same scenario next year that we have this year. This year, we have picks 14 and 23. Next year, we’ll probably end up at 12 or 13, and then the Knicks pick will be around 20, either above or below it.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 24, 2011 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree, just laying out the possibilities.
Rockets receive the Knicks’ 2012 first-round pick (top 5 protected in 2012, 2013, 2014, and 2015, if not conveyed by 2015 then the Rockets will receive the Knicks 2015 and 2016 second-round picks)
Nets receive the Rockets’ 2012 first-round pick (top 14 protected in 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, and 2016, if not conveyed by 2016 then the Nets will receive the Rockets’ 2017 second-round pick)
Rockets receive the Grizzlies’ 2013 first-round pick (Lottery protected in 2013; remaining conditions currently unknown)
So reasonably…
2012 a lottery pick (our own) and one in the 20’s (Knicks)
2013 a lottery pick (our own) and one in the 20’s (Grizzlies) or just the Grizzlies pick if we make the playoffs
There’s second round stuff going on too, but I didn’t look it up.
It's obvious our sample size is ridiculously small to judge him.
But why are the people who are calling him our potential superstar any more right than the ones who claim he is our next dud?
"You know how Einstein got bad grades as a kid? Well, mine are
even worse! " ~Bill Watterson, Calvin and Hobbes
by TheChuckwagonisrolling on May 24, 2011 6:48 AM CDT reply actions
It's similar to having all the ingredients for cookies sitting on front of you.
The ingredients are his raw skills and what we know he can do. People saying he won’t ever become anything more/judging him harshly are people looking at ingredients and saying “He will never be cookies, he is separate ingredients!” Whereas the people who see that he could be a star are saying “He’s got good quality vanilla, sugar, and eggs, he needs to sift the flour for texture and the butter needs to hit room temperature but I’d totally have sex with those cookies once they get put together!”
The difference is you have people evaluating what little they have and being dismissive versus people who are looking at what those components are and seeing that it can come together. One party is getting dismissive about a guy base on short-sighted abuse of “results”, the other realize you have to analyze him qualitatively on the skills you see, not the numbers that were produced because extrapolation is necessary.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
I just think that his ingredients don't add up to an awesome cookie.
I suppose we are both seeing the same ingredints, but analyzing them differently. But it was a good analogy. You see the potential for some bad-ass chocolate chip cookies, and I see potential for some decent peanut butter cookies.
"You know how Einstein got bad grades as a kid? Well, mine are
even worse! " ~Bill Watterson, Calvin and Hobbes
by TheChuckwagonisrolling on May 24, 2011 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions
As far as I see it, both cookies are delicious.
Maybe we make Peanut Butter Chocolate Chip and we’re all satisfied?
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
That would be a very interesting combo...i might have to try that.
"You know how Einstein got bad grades as a kid? Well, mine are
even worse! " ~Bill Watterson, Calvin and Hobbes
by TheChuckwagonisrolling on May 24, 2011 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Basically what BD said.
He has all of the tools and the skills to become an All-Star, but he has yet to show them.
This year will be his year. He’ll likely get at least 20 minutes per game, depending on how he does in Pre-Season, assuming that we have one.
However, he may not pan out.
Just have to wait and see.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
by bone31crusher on May 24, 2011 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions
I lean toward dud and I do it because I am relying on the professional opinions made by others with adequate sample size.
The Nets had ~2000 NBA minutes to evaluate him and yet they traded him for a low 1st rounder. RA had more of a sample size than us and he deemed him a current dud.
Having said that, I think it’s obvious he has talent and great players have been traded for less.
As to your main point, using the small sample size argument definitely works both ways. To me, personally, he’s a complete unknown and labeling him either way is unfair.
New Jersey traded him because he had hit an impasse with Avery Johnson, that's not a knock on Terrence's skill. If it is let me know your average player's "Avery Johnson Compatibility" rating outside of dating sites.
Williams was banished to the dog house because he didn’t get along with a stubborn coach and New Jersey flipped him for what came along in a trade.
As far as people using the small sample size, if I may revisit the cookie analogy. The pro-Terrence Williams camp says “Hey, I can see cookies out of this.” The anti-Williams people almost summarily say “I do not have cookies on front of me, therefore they will never be cookies.” They ignore, bar none, that there has been no effort to combine the ingredients and bake it (Done through the fire of game time). When it comes to people abusing the small sample size it’s the anti-Williams people.
Yes, the profile picture is a dude wailing a guitar and kicking a rhino in the giggleberries while an explosion goes off in the background. I'm kind of like that in person. Awesome.
Does anybody see Kevin McHale molding T-Will?
I don’t.
Not a knock on either, but I just don’t see a natural chemistry developing between the two.
And while it’s all but confirmed, it appears McHale is the next coach,
by Nobody is Better Than Jordan on May 24, 2011 5:44 PM CDT reply actions
umm
when i was watching the last few game of the season i didnt see twill
i did not know he was still with the team, i would like him to play his passing is quick, and his speed would be tough for some Pgs to match up with.
did he have surgery or something.
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