Rockets Leading the Chris Kaman Bandwagon
by Mike Kerns on Feb 1, 2012 2:17 PM CST
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PrintAccording to Sports Illustrated's Sam Amick, your Houston Rockets might be about to have not one, but two centers on their roster.
While no deal is imminent and the pieces are still being discussed, sources said the talks have involved the Rockets' two top-10 picks from the 2009 draft -- center Hasheem Thabeet (No. 2 by Memphis) and power forward Jordan Hill (No. 8 by New York). The Rockets have other young former first-rounders who could be included as well, among them second-year forward Patrick Patterson, third-year point guard Jonny Flynn and third-year small forward Terrence Williams. They also have a 2012 first-round pick from the Knicks that the Hornets would love to obtain.
Now, we all realize that this is a move for the contract, not the player, but that trade right there looks to be a steal if it only costs the "09ers" to get done. I still don't like hearing the words Patrick Patterson listed in there, but that seems to come up in all of these potential deals.
An expiring $14 million contract sure sounds quite intriguing for whatever Morey has in mind for the offseason.
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If we strike out this offseason
Can we just rebuild?
Sonicsgate: A movie about how the Sonics were stolen from Seattle.
by .Bonzo on Feb 1, 2012 2:22 PM CST via mobile reply actions
I still have no idea what DM is doing.
Why trade expiring contracts of the ’09ers and possibly a pick for another expiring?
beacause
Kaman can at least help this season…i know some ppl have love for the 09 draftees we have but they are pretty much dead weight on this team
yeah...its almost like a freebee
we all know that the 09ers suck…or are only marginal players at best.
Kaman can play solid minutes.
Maybe having a player who you can resign with decent money is a good chip for sign and trades…particualry if you are gunning for Howard. Just an idea.
Trading Orlando D and Kaman for Howard helps them fill that gap while they draft/trade for a good replacement center that is a long term solution for them
Freebie to pass on a deeper draft to just strike out for it in later drafts and overspend on marginal talent to meet a salary floor.
No point in shuffling expiring deals like this.
Maireann croí éadrom i bhfad.
I think Morey has been dealt a hand by Mr. Alexander
His hand? 9,8 suited… not a great starting hand at all but has potential for something good to spectacular.
The other GM’s already have high pocket pairs or AK. Morey is trying to get lucky and catch a miracle straight flush and save his session…..but also is risking heavily on gone home broke.
Sometimes you have to push it all-in and hope for the best. If it doesnt work out…..reload and start over….probably not in Houston LOL
I got totally thrown off there.
My point is that in short, we’re doing it wrong. This was the year to just say screw it and cash in. We’re contemplating a lateral move salary wise to improve odds on a season that is potentially worthless at the end of the day because it’s a false positive out of a season where we’re intent on shedding everyone we can salary wise to get rebuffed in Free Agency.
Maireann croí éadrom i bhfad.
Well
At least Kaman won’t be on the books after this season.
flayed ones stealth mode
"Fleshling! Do not shoot! For I am one of you fleshy things. It is I. Your Uncle Stan. Can't you tell by the long strips of fleshy substances covered in bodily fluids? Trust me! I have fleeeeeeeeesh."
That's a non-factor, honestly.
Aside from Patterson there’s no such thing as a guy who was gonna have his money on the roster anyway. It’s entirely lateral in that regard. Why “go all in” this year for a false positive and pass up on a good draft?
Maireann croí éadrom i bhfad.
I agree...
that Kaman, even if he plays really well, for just one year when we are in all seriously likelyhood, not going to contend for any draft pick is stupid.
I do not want to give any draft pick for him whatsoever…even a second rounder this year or next….
but if the trade is to give them Hill, TWill, Thabeet, Flynn and a box of warm gummie bears from my pocket that are nice and warm from being there all day, I am in.
That is all….but agreed…no draft for any round and for any year for Kaman
What if we traded Hill, a 2nd rd pick, and SCOLA for Kaman?
This way if the Rockets wanted to try and get 2 max free agents they wouldnt have to amnesty Scola.
Also, we kinda see Scola not holding up with this schedule and PPatt would get better with more playing time.
I think were miscommunicating here
I don’t think we’ll have to give up a draft pick for him, and you do.
flayed ones stealth mode
"Fleshling! Do not shoot! For I am one of you fleshy things. It is I. Your Uncle Stan. Can't you tell by the long strips of fleshy substances covered in bodily fluids? Trust me! I have fleeeeeeeeesh."
I think I just assumed since that was the common talk.
I mean, Stern’s MO isn’t necessarily sensible negotiation, right?
Maireann croí éadrom i bhfad.
We'll
hthats a legitimate counterpoint lol
flayed ones stealth mode
"Fleshling! Do not shoot! For I am one of you fleshy things. It is I. Your Uncle Stan. Can't you tell by the long strips of fleshy substances covered in bodily fluids? Trust me! I have fleeeeeeeeesh."
I agree but the only thing I can think of is that...
1) decent centers are hard to come by
2) when healthy Kaman is a decent center
3) Rox already know what they don’t have in the current ‘09ers and we didn’t extend them anyway so who cares
4) Rox get to try out Kaman, see what he is made of, is he worth salvaging, worth convincing to resign and stay with Houston, etc…
5) Maybe there is another possible player or potential trade in the mix…maybe that involved Dalembert or something that we may need Kaman to help fill.
6) Morey ate too many acid laced Twinkies over the weekend.
(you just know that guy is a Twinkie eater)
when Healthy
Kamen is more than decent, he is actually very good
by NVP on Feb 1, 2012 8:32 PM CST up reply actions
It's for additional cap space
DM could trade a bunch of players who aren’t really contributing (there’s no way they include Patterson) for, say, $10MM worth of salaries, and take on Kaman’s $14MM contract, which leaves us an additional $4MM to play with next offseason.
This stuff is really starting to add up…
- Amnesty Scola or KMart for about $10MM
- Buy out Dalembert’s team-option $7MM
- $14MM for Kaman’s expiring
Two max contracts… That’s what DM is doing.
by Moochie's Fro on Feb 1, 2012 5:49 PM CST up reply actions
It's either him or Scola
Scola’s obviously way older so we could still get a lot more out of KMart, but I have no problem with getting rid of KMart because he’s way more inconsistent (and WILDLY…either 30 or 2) than Scola. And if you keep your pick next year, you draft a sg: Terrence Ross, Austin RIvers, Dion Waiters, there’s some guys out there to replace.
Martin would be dumb to amnesty
I hope we trade scola in this deal. I doubt it happens but if they want the knicks pick they have to take him. I loved the Kaman & ariza for Scola and 09s. it makes some cents since Aminu is better than Ariza and we still need a solid SF. OH PLEASE LET THAT HAPPEN!
I'm not averse to getting Trevor back.
I think people have nightmares about him as a primary option attempt but seem to forget the fact that he performed very well as a second or third fiddle on the Rockets by the end of his time here.
Maireann croí éadrom i bhfad.
agreed...and he would improve our woeful D some of the time
I would really miss Scola though. No one has been more consitently bringing it like him
No one has been so consistently fading over the course of a game this season either.
Maireann croí éadrom i bhfad.
Because Dalembert & Kaman are going to Orlando for Dwight!!!
Yeah,right.
by Mike Kerns on Feb 1, 2012 2:32 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
depends on what Morey thinks we are
If we can get Kaman for Thabeet and Hill and maybe a future lottery protected first, then we don’t lose much and we have 2 legit post options. If we are gunning for a real run in the playoffs this makes us better with minimal sacrifice (while we stay flexible). Definitely helps with teams like the lakers and the clippers. We better not trade PPatt.
The 09ers are better as trade fodder than as expirings. We aren’t going to get a star in the free agent market (unless Lowry becomes enough of a star to draw someone else).
by Christopher Dion Harris on Feb 1, 2012 2:56 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
PATTERSON?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!
hes like my favorite..
Go Rockets!
"Our players knew we were going to win so kinda let up on defense." Kevin Mchale
"Screw Stern!" Me
under no circumstances do I see us including Patterson in a trade for only Kaman
if it happens I will become a full time fan of Portland and the 76ers and will have to wait until Morey leaves to like the Rockets again
and to add
If we then trade for a stephen jackson?, pau Gasol, Paul pierce, or Danny granger, (or whatever legit player can be had at the deadline) we’d be in position to really make some noise.
by Christopher Dion Harris on Feb 1, 2012 2:59 PM CST via iPhone app reply actions
i wonder if kaman could be able to play like he did that year wen he was an all star
Go Rockets!
"Our players knew we were going to win so kinda let up on defense." Kevin Mchale
"Screw Stern!" Me
as long as he's better than Hill
And I think Olajuwon could take Hill right now.
by Christopher Dion Harris on Feb 1, 2012 3:06 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Now, we all realize that this is a move for the contract, not the player, but that trade right there looks to be a steal if it only costs the “09ers” to get done
If the trade were to involve only the ‘09 guys, it wouldn’t be for the contract, because Kaman won’t save us any money — all the ’09 players expire at the end of this season.
If anything, this move is likely to cost the Rockets money this year, but it won’t change their cap numbers at all next year.
Of course, if somebody else gets included, things change.
unless Alexander cares...
then it may be a no brainer to get him for this season.
You lose warm bodies for practice and Hills very very spotty play but Kaman can play every night, when healthy.
…but being healthy is the key isn’t it
A second legit center with D, makes us able to go really big in post D in certain circumstances, helping make up for Scola’s lack of D….and makes SF our biggest hole.
But if it ultimately is just trading Hill for Kaman it is a no brainer to do this….it also gives us a view of Kaman and him of us to resign with us for less money at the end of his contract
I doubt Alexander cares too much.
We were in the luxury tax last year, after all. We’re talking, at the most, $5 million added in salary. That shouldn’t be enough to push us into the tax range, anyways, and it’s clear that ownership is willing to spend money to get some more wins.
If Patterson is in this deal,
then we better get Aminu in return along with Kaman.
"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.
screw the platter
it’s probably too much to ask for….just the head please!
by EveryHoustonTeamRox! on Feb 1, 2012 3:41 PM CST up reply actions
and for that matter
on a stick would be better
by EveryHoustonTeamRox! on Feb 1, 2012 3:41 PM CST up reply actions
Interesting.
But I will withhold judgement until more details emerge or a deal becomes official. Until then, I will twiddle my thumbs in the corner over there.
The bird is struggling out of the egg. The egg is the world. Whoever wants to be born, must first destroy a world.
by Stupendous Man on Feb 1, 2012 3:46 PM CST via mobile reply actions
OBVIOUSLY it gets denied by Stern For Basketball Reasons
Why?? Because it helps Houston in free agency!
I think its a good trade and makes Houston much more flexible and can even give them even more cap room this summer depending on the trade.
I think this year is Morey’s all-in or BUST.
we already have enough cap room
For a max deal. This is a win now deal (I’m sure we’d end up giving up a draft asset somewhere down the line, which is fine). If we could scoop up a real 3 for pieces some where before the deadline (say Courtney Lee for Beasley or scola for josh smith) this deal is a home run. We could legitimately contend this year (assuming Kyle gets his form back).
by Christopher Dion Harris on Feb 1, 2012 4:56 PM CST via iPhone app up reply actions
Thabeet, Hill, & Flynn
works on the machine. Throw in a second and it looks good to me. I don’t think they can swing a low first for him. Gives Morey a chance to test his theory about getting guys to resign to play here.
One thing you have to realize about this trade
This trade is NOT an expiring contract trade. We’re talking about trading expiring contracts for expiring contracts. This is a trade that could push us from being the first team eft out of the playoffs to a 7 or 8 seed in the playoffs.
Radio interview with Bullard
Interesting to listen to.
"I always keep a ball in the car. You never know."
-Hakeem Olajuwon
"Stern Sucks"
-Me
I like Patterson, but including him isnt a deal breaker
Considering there are a ton of Power forwards in this draft with higher upside like Anthony Davis, Perry Jones, Terrence Jones, Thomas Robinson, Sullinger, Cody Zeller, Patrick Young, Joshua Smith, John Henson, and I’m sure I’m missing someone. Also Donotas is a power forward with insane potential and is most likely coming over next year.
by wdh001 on Feb 1, 2012 5:48 PM CST via mobile reply actions
I'm all for parting ways with Patrick Patterson at some point...
however Kris Kaman cannot be a center-piece of what is in return.
temporary avatar change...
It may just be that.
You’re dealing with Stern.
by Nobody is Better Than Jordan on Feb 1, 2012 5:59 PM CST up reply actions
From an outsider...
sure it looks like expirings for expirings… But our FO told the 09ers where they could stick it last week, so seriously what’s the point. Obviously of the group, Jordan Hill is arguably in the roations, of course as an un-natural back up C. For New Orleans and this situation, it makes total sense to acquire young players and see what happens. (Although Morey already tried and failed). But you get the point, having a 14 mil/season guy on one of the worst teams in basketball getting Did not Play-Coaches Decision, like I sais what’s the point? Not just that, perhaps it can be more playing time to develop that white dude Smith or whoever who single-handedly almost came from behind and beat us. I’m assuming he can come in and play C if the Hornets ever decide to go small.
temporary avatar change...
Deal with Stern again!?!
Morey’s got some balls.
Kaman and Dalembert could compliment eachother well, but Kaman can’t be the only piece they send over. Especially if Houston’s unloading all those guys at once.
by Nobody is Better Than Jordan on Feb 1, 2012 5:57 PM CST reply actions
I know
We’d miss his writing on the Dream Shake for sure.
Check out The Dream Shake.
by Patrick Harrel on Feb 1, 2012 10:50 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Scola
If the Knicks pick is going to NO, they better be taking Scola’s contract back. Let the cheap asses in the league office write the check to amnesty him and tack it on to the purchase price in return for that Christmas gift.
Sorry, I just can't figure out.
What makes an expiring contract good for a team? I’ve seemed to notice more people get more excited, the more it’s worth.
"I’m not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information." Bill Watterson~Calvin and Hobbes
by The Chuckwagon has rolled on on Feb 1, 2012 6:22 PM CST reply actions
So, the NBA has a salary cap.
Teams over the cap can’t sign free agents (except for a few cases: you can sign players to a minimum salary, each team gets a “midlevel exception” of a few million they can use to sign players each year, and you can go over the salary cap to re-sign your own players — the so-called “Bird rights.” There are a few other exceptional cases like injured player exceptions… the Rockets got one of those in 2010 because Yao was going to be out all year, you might remember, which they used on Ariza instead of the Mid-Level Exception). Furthermore, teams over the cap have to make salaries roughly match when making trades with one another. And you can’t just get rid of a guy from your payroll by cutting him from the team, since contracts are guaranteed — he still cou
So if you’re over the cap, the only way to get under the cap (and thus be able to make a deal or two with free agents in the next offseason) is to trade your longer contracts for an expiring contract.
Expiring deals thus have a lot of value to them: you can use them to get under the cap, and you can take them on without having to worry about your cap space in the coming offseason.
For this rumored deal, it looks like the Rockets are mostly talking about dealing expiring contracts (Hill, Flynn, Thabeet, Williams) for Kaman, so this isn’t an issue of saving cap space for the summer — the only reason to like Kaman’s contract is that it basically doesn’t matter. He has no effect on your cap space this summer.
The biggest deal involving expiring contracts you might remember from Rockets history is the McGrady deal in 2010. McGrady’s contract expired that year, and the Rockets wanted to acquire a player to pair with Yao in 2011. At the same time, Donnie Walsh and the Knicks were trying to get under the cap so they could make a run at the 2010 free agent class. So they traded Jeffries (on contract until 2011), Hill (expiring in ‘11, options for this year and next), the rights to swap picks last year and a protected 1st round pick to us basically for T-Mac’s contract, meanwhile they sent Larry Hughes (who had a ridiculous contract and was on the books for last year, I think) to Sacramento, we sent Carl Landry to Sacramento, and the Kings gave us Martin.
Even though McGrady’s value as a player was very low that year, he had an enormous expiring contract that allowed the Knicks to clear space and give Amare a max deal, so they gave up a lot to get him.
by Only_A_Lad on Feb 1, 2012 6:37 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Hell of an explanation. Thank you very much, sir
"I’m not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information." Bill Watterson~Calvin and Hobbes
by The Chuckwagon has rolled on on Feb 1, 2012 6:56 PM CST up reply actions
Kaman experienced big man and unhappy in NO
check him out physically first but its good deal as long as no 1st rounders are involved.
The content of the text above is provided for information purposes only. No claim is made as to the accuracy or authenticity of the content. The troll does not accept any liability to any person for the information or advice (or the use of such information or advice) which is provided in the text above.
I don't get it.
We can lose the 09ers as UFAs anyway since we declined to exercise the final years of their rookie contracts, so trading them for Kaman is freeing up cap space that’s already freed up. Trading PatPat just for cap space doesn’t make sense since his contract only ranges from $2-4M over the next 3 years, which is less than he’s worth.
Morey won't trade PatPat. He's Morey's kind of player.
And I think you’re missing the point. We’re acquiring this guy to make us good now rather than later.
I'd really like it if this trade could include Scola instead of Hill.
It probably won’t. But it would be nice if it could.
Also, if this trade goes through, definitely sign Greg Smith.
I wouldn't include Patterson or a 1st round pick
but if one has to be included, it’s Patterson. The deal doesn’t save us any money in the future, only adds money this season.
by twinkilling0303 on Feb 1, 2012 11:02 PM CST reply actions
If Morey can pull this one off
he’ll get get the sainthood
don't bully me, i am from the D(etroit)!!!
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