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How much is Linsanity worth in a trade?

While the news of today is that Carmelo Anthony returned to the Knicks’ lineup only to indirectly create a glitch in the Linsanity phenomenon (Nets beat Knicks behind 38 from Deron Williams), there still was no stopping Jeremy Lin, at least on a statistical box-score stuffing level. He racked up a near triple-double with 21, 9 and 7. Of course, he only had three turnovers this time, way below his recent average.

As Stan Marsh’s karate teacher would say: he racks disaprine.[1]

Now, like Deron Williams, I am relatively bored by the whole pop culture fascination with Jeremy Lin. He is simply a basketball player. A pretty good one by all recent account, and he definitely is an interesting story, but it helps to maintain a little bit of perspective. Just a little. No, I do not say this because my beloved Rockets had him on the roster only to cut him loose just a couple months ago. And no, I do not even think it was a "mistake" to cut him given the information known at the time. And no, it is not because every Lin win is costing the Rockets a better draft spot – though that is annoying.

I say this because there are far more interesting things we can be discussing other than whose couch Mr. Lin slept on last weekend.

Namely: what is Jeremy Lin’s trade value today?

Presumably, even with the frenzy of Linsanity, the Knicks cannot deem him untouchable. For instance, if the Miami Heat were to offer up LeBron for Lin and Stoudemire, not even the James Dolan/Isiah Thomas duo would hesitate to pull the trigger. Thus, there has to be an acceptable threshold of pain whereby the Knicks would sacrifice this current media sensation for the future good of the franchise.

Right?

Let the fun begin: after the jump.



[1] Yeah, that’s right… I made an Asian joke. Good thing I do not work for ESPN.

Star-divide

As we should know by now, Jeremy Lin is a 2nd year player. He’s making the essential minimum ($762,195, pro-rated to $610,000), an amount now famously guaranteed for the year. Because of this, at the end of the year, he’s a restricted free agent. The Knicks do not necessarily have to worry about teams overpaying for Lin as a free agent, due in part to the Gilbert Arenas rule, whereby the max offer he can receive is the "average" NBA salary. That could be in the $5-6M range. Eminently affordable. Also, this is a contract most teams would be readily eager to pay to acquire. Which is where the analysis begins.

Per the new CBA, teams below the salary cap may trade without regard to salary, as long as they don't end up more than $100,000 above the cap following a trade. Teams above the cap (or teams below the cap but would end up more than $100,000 over the cap following a trade) cannot acquire more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary they trade away.

Also, because Lin was acquired via waivers, he cannot be traded until February 27, 2012, when his trade restrictions expire (yeah, a whole six days from now).

Let’s say the Magic are not completely asleep at the wheel right now and want to offer a Dwight Howard Godfather package:

Orlando Magic offer:

Dwight Howard ($18,091,000) and Ryan Anderson ($2,244,000)

for

Jeremy Lin ($762,195) and Amare Stoudemire’s bad knees ($18,217,000)

This would fit within the 125% rule even though the Knicks are above the soft salary cap.

Who blinks first here? Orlando would get value for Howard immediately, and we know he’s not going to be with the team in 2012-13. The Knicks would give up a media sensation. Nevertheless, they would not only be acquiring the best center in the NBA (by far), they’d also be able to stick it to the Nets, who have been desperate to acquire Howard. Howard would be able to sign a better extension with the Knicks, too, and since it is New York – Howard has to like that. Plus, he’d get to play with Carmelo.

Los Angeles Lakers?

What if the Lakers get wind of this and offer up a package around Pau Gasol, if only to get Kobe to shut up and quit complaining about management?

Pau Gasol ($18,714,000) and … and… ugh, the Lakers have no depth. At all.

for

Jeremy Lin and Amare Stoudemire

Okay, so the Knicks probably laugh at this one and say no. Then again, you never know with James Dolan. He might actually be jealous of Jeremy Lin and the attention.

But what if the Lakers get desperate (and they are desperate for a PG) and offer up:

Pau Gasol ($18,714,000) and Matt Barnes ($1,906,000)

for

Jeremy Lin and Tyson Chandler ($13,107,000)[1] and JR Smith ($6,757,000)

That has to at least get the Knicks’ attention, right? And the Lakers’ desperation for a point guard (much less one with the current "wow" factor Lin has) cannot be underestimated.

Miami Heat???

Meanwhile, I mentioned LeBron before. But that’s an unlikely name. Yet the Heat could offer up……. Chris Bosh. And the Heat are also a PG-needy team. Not sure what the Asian climate is in South Beach , but a team of LeBron, Wade and Lin would definitely make the Interwebz blow up from page hits and unwanted media attention.

How’s this for an offer:

Chris Bosh ($16,022,000) and Norris Cole ($1,035,000)

for

Jeremy Lin, Tyson Chandler ($13,107,000) and Iman Shumpert ($1,563,000)

The Knicks would at the very least have to consider this, right? Meanwhile, the Heat would almost certainly be excited at this prospective trade, presuming that trading Bosh would not make LeBron get all bitchy and moody from losing a friend.[2] Imagine a lineup of Lin, Wade and LeBron, with a random scrub at PF and Tyson Chandler protecting the rim? This is a trade that could theoretically improve both teams. Even if it would sabotage the stock value of MSG just as quick as Jeremy Lin raised it.

The possibilities are, at the very least, intriguing. And to think… it all centers on a 23-year old kid that was very nearly reduced to relying on just his Harvard degree to succeed in life.

That’s Linsanity for ya.



[1] Chandler ’s trade restrictions expire March 1, 2012

[2] Then again, when is LeBron not bitchy and moody?

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The Magic offer

is crazy for Orlando. They are better off with the cap space than Amare. That trade ONLY makes sense if you think that Lin is a legit top 5 / top 10 point guard.

The Pau for Amare + Lin is somewhat better, but I don’t think it actually makes either team better, probably hurts the Knicks. Again, only makes sense if the Lakers think that Lin is a top 5 / 10 point guard. And if he is, than this trade is incredibly stupid for the Knicks.

Pau + Barnes for Lin + Chandler + Smith is worse than the Marc for Pau trade. Chandler is better than Pau this season, and probably will be for the next couple seasons, for less money. Lin and Smith are both playing better than Barnes That would be an insane trade for the Knicks. Heck, this is a bad trade even if Lin and Smith are just scrubs.

As to the heat trade, again, I’ll take Chandler and Lin over Chris Bosh. Chandler is a significantly better defender and only a slighly worse offensive player. Miami would make that trade in a heartbeat, and the knicks would be idiots to make that trade. Even a straight up Bosh for Chandler trade is a bad deal for the Knicks.

Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.

by ihavethemelody on Feb 21, 2012 10:17 AM CST reply actions  

you were making sense until...

“a straight up Bosh for Chandler trade is a bad deal for the Knicks”.

Say what? I like Chandler, but he’s no all-star and he needs certain players around him to be successful. He’s very one-dimensional on offense, too.

People like to pick on Bosh – for good and obvious reasons – but he’s far better than Chandler.

by grungedave on Feb 21, 2012 10:21 AM CST up reply actions  

What would

the Knicks do with Bosh?

Have their starting 3 become Amare at center, Melo at SF, and Bosh at PF? That’s a defensive nightmare. Sure, that team would make the playoffs, but they would have almost no chance at all of making it to the championship, let alone the eastern conference finals.

At least the team, as currently constructed, has the potential to put it all together and make a run. I don’t see that even being possible without chandler in the middle.

Meat? They're made out of Meat? Meat.

by ihavethemelody on Feb 21, 2012 10:35 AM CST up reply actions  

In the eyes of most

Bosh > Chandler.

As a GM, if you see an opportunity to get better assets – you do it. If you could swap Bosh for Chandler you’d have to do it because you could them flip Bosh for even better assets.

It’s like asking if you want a dollar back for only 75 cents – you might as well take it because you can then use that dollar to buy more stuff.

by David Vega on Feb 21, 2012 10:38 AM CST up reply actions  

I'm with you on this one Dave

Chris Bosh has an extremely polished offensive game. I can’t take anyone seriously who claims his offensive game is “only slightly better than Chandler’s.”

While I don’t see either player as a guy who “gets you there,” I do see Bosh as having better potential for that.

by David Vega on Feb 21, 2012 10:35 AM CST up reply actions  

bosh is the better player

but for the money, give me chandler

bosh just looks like he doesnt care

@THEREALALLENOU on twitter - "The man, the verb, the legend" OU'd

by AllenOU on Feb 21, 2012 11:00 AM CST up reply actions  

I cried in titanic

and I didnt give two shits about any of those people

@THEREALALLENOU on twitter - "The man, the verb, the legend" OU'd

by AllenOU on Feb 21, 2012 12:04 PM CST up reply actions  

There won't be a sensible trade for Lin

His value is much larger than his effect on the court, especially to New York. Plus other teams will have a hard time evaluating him given the small sample size and the fact that he is a point guard in D’antoni’s system. Also, Stoudemire, with his current contract and cap room becoming more valuable, will probably be seen as a burden more than an asset by many teams unless they are convinced that he is what they need to get over the hump for a short run at a chamionship.

by apt2rant on Feb 21, 2012 10:28 AM CST reply actions  

missing the point

The concept is that Lin isn’t “untouchable”. If LeBron were offered as part of a package, the Knicks wouldn’t hesitate. So……. what are the various trades that would make sense. Because there have to be at least a handful. Even in the face of Linsanity.

by grungedave on Feb 21, 2012 10:38 AM CST up reply actions  

The issue with trading Jeremy Lin right now is his pay

If he had a salary even a few million more, it would make a sensible trade much more easier because of the whole balancing salaries in trades thing.

A void? I see no void!

by gunsbound on Feb 21, 2012 10:32 AM CST reply actions  

yup

I agree. That’s why this got truncated. I couldn’t find any other teams with the right mix of assets and salary considerations.

by grungedave on Feb 21, 2012 10:39 AM CST up reply actions  

I bet the knicks would trade lin for lowry straight up

@THEREALALLENOU on twitter - "The man, the verb, the legend" OU'd

by AllenOU on Feb 21, 2012 11:01 AM CST reply actions  

but Morey would say no

because Morey isn’t a sucker for headlines.

by grungedave on Feb 21, 2012 11:32 AM CST up reply actions  

exactly

@THEREALALLENOU on twitter - "The man, the verb, the legend" OU'd

by AllenOU on Feb 21, 2012 11:35 AM CST up reply actions  

Reminds me of the joke

where the guy asks the hot chick at the bar if she would sleep with him for $1,000,000? She says yes and he asks if $50 would do it? She angrily asks what he thinks she is? He tells her they have established that, we are just trying to settle on a price.
The better question is, will the Knicks decide that someone else is expendable? I think that if they start to loose now that Melo is back, that question will come up. The media in NYC is brutal and that’s a kind way to put it. If they start even playing just above 50%, I can see folks demanding that something be done. Could make the deadline interesting.

by makinmajik on Feb 21, 2012 11:23 AM CST reply actions  

they played crap teams except LAL

now the SCH gets real, and melo comes back.

its not on melo, but the schedule

they arent a very good team

@THEREALALLENOU on twitter - "The man, the verb, the legend" OU'd

by AllenOU on Feb 21, 2012 11:36 AM CST up reply actions  

IMO yes yes yes

call up NJ, and say… here you go. you take amare, lin, jeffries,schubert. we want lopez and D will

@THEREALALLENOU on twitter - "The man, the verb, the legend" OU'd

by AllenOU on Feb 21, 2012 12:05 PM CST up reply actions  

Right?

Its cant be forgotten how bad the KNICKS need a PG as well. It seems like if they dish Lin they have to get one back in return.

Rectum!? Damn near killed 'em!!!

by theSpaceCityKid on Feb 21, 2012 2:03 PM CST up reply actions  

I honestly don't think he's worth as much as a lot of people think.

D’Antoni has a great system, and Lin fits into it perfectly. Take him away from D’Antoni’s system, and I don’t think he’d even be half the player then that he is right now. Sure, he’s been pretty impressive in 1on1 situations, but if you watch him play an entire game, you’d never think he be putting up the massive numbers that he’s putting up right now.

He got decent minutes at Golden State last year, and he didn’t really do anything special. I’m just not convinced that he’s legitimately a good PG.

As far as trade value goes, I wouldn’t even think about trading him for Lowry. I wouldn’t trade Morris for him, or Patterson, or Parsons, or Lee. I wouldn’t mind trading Dragic and Martin for him, or maybe even Dalembert or Scola, but I wouldn’t trade any of our young players for him. Still too skeptical.

"Hakeem couldn't kick your ass cuz you were too
close kissin his!"- Sir Charles to Kenny Smith.

by bone31crusher on Feb 21, 2012 12:17 PM CST reply actions  

for ticket sale purposes alone

the Knicks would never trade Lin for any of the Rockets players. Not even Lowry (and Morey wouldn’t trade Lowry for Lin). If there was a feasible trade with the Rockets I would have listed it… but there isn’t one.

The whole point is that if NYK was smart, they’d take advantage of Linsanity by moving him for proven basketball players.

by grungedave on Feb 21, 2012 12:37 PM CST up reply actions  

Except for a couple of things.

One is, the NYK PG corps pre Lin were entirely worthless. DAntonis system didn’t make them better and Shumpert certainly has more physical ability. Nash is still a great player at 38, without DAntoni.

I always find it to be an unfair criticism to act as though someone’s accomplishments are weak because they’re in the right spot. The players of any sport who are great in any situation whatsoever are your true superstars, but that simply means Lin isn’t a superstar. But he’s in the right spot, so he doesn’t have to be.

Those are all star numbers however they’re derived – the points are real NBA points, same with assists etc. For an undrafted guy cut twice, that’s pretty impressive.

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by Xiane on Feb 21, 2012 2:12 PM CST up reply actions  

couldn't have said it better myself...

JLin deserves what he gets…he’s earned his way to star status through hard work and dedication…and on top of it all, he has to deal with extremely racist comments around the world…as an Asian American, I feel proud to see him represent Azn Americans well…now I wait for the day when a player of Indian American roots takes over the NBA…

ROCKETS!!!!!!!!!!!!

by Roxbybirth on Feb 21, 2012 2:43 PM CST up reply actions  

couple things

First, no one thinks that Lin is not entitled to everything he has worked for. He seems like a genuinely good person who really deserves the recent adulation. I have yet to see a truly bad thing written about him either as a player or a person.

Second, a heavy majority of the NBA is black. I’m going to guess that they encounter just as much racism on a day-to-day basis as Jeremy Lin might. Probably more. So, maybe back off a bit on making Lin some sort of poster child for racism against Asians. (And even the now infamous ESPN headline was not racist. It was not even using the term as a “slur”. ESPN, being owned by Disney, overreacted.) So, please let’s stick to the topic at hand. No one is denigrating Jeremy Lin.

by grungedave on Feb 21, 2012 3:34 PM CST up reply actions  

wow.

couple things. by people saying JLin is purely a product of NY media hype and D’Antoni’s system, they ARE saying JLin is not entitled to the adulation he’s getting, regardless if you qualify it by saying “he’s a good guy, he’s worked hard, he deserves it, blah blah blah.” much like how some ppl qualify racist comments by saying “no way i’m racist, i’ve got friends that are ____.”

secondly, the title wasn’t blatantly vicious racism. that rarely exists anymore in mainstream media. institutionalized and subtle racism however, does exist. if a white guy drops a phrase such as “what up mah n***a” but says “but i didn’t mean it as a slur!” it’s still wrong. just don’t say it. if someone’s offended at a word that IS A RACIAL slur, get over it. just be smarter. but yes, let’s stay on topic here…

i realize rocket fans are still bitter about JLin getting away for no compensation, but i think he’s shown the ability to take a good system and run it well, even when surrounded by role players and his age should play into trade value as well. i think different teams will value him differently depending on their systems. i could see a team like phoenix being interested. if jerry sloan were still coaching, he’d fit with utah as well, as disgusting as that is to say.

by lfe159 on Feb 21, 2012 5:52 PM CST up reply actions  

No no no, Let's get these 2 thing clear up

Jeremy Lin is not a product on NY media hype, Linsanity is.

By the shear proportions of it makes it pretty much impossible to live up, the fact that whether Lin and Melo can play together is a popular topic of discussion, a minimum player mentioned as an equal of, not just a good NBA player, but one of the best player. Anyone did what he did will have the same praise and doubts, whatever race he is.

You cannot deny it took a series of right situation for it to happen, the fact that he literally would’ve been waive if he didnt put up gawking numbers. Good number would have gotten him waived. The fact that a supposedly talented NYK were struggling so badly they they went to a player that the coach didnt know the name of.

No one should be bitter about Jeremy Lin not being a rocket, because it literally would not have happen. If we had kept him, we’d have killed his career, I have no doubt. However, NYK would be nuts to let him go, because the ridiculous marketbility

by NVP on Feb 21, 2012 8:51 PM CST up reply actions  

umm...
i don't think anyone was arguing with the points u made. i think any reasonable person sees that JLin's rise was the result of a perfect storm. and again, that aligns with my point that going from JLin to Linsanity was not the result of any one factor, but all of them.

and i contend with you saying anyone doing what he did would have had just as much praise/hype. i would say “Linsanity” is a global phenomena b/c of his Asian heritage. without that, he’s just another up n coming NBA player, not a stereotype demolisher.

by lfe159 on Feb 21, 2012 9:14 PM CST up reply actions  

No they would not have the same cultural impact

it would be an NBA story rather than a pop culture story, magnitude would be different.

However I’m strictly talking from a sports perspective and among NBA people, the same savier of Knick praise would have been the same, the same doubt of who is this guy and why is he breaking records as an undrafted player, is he legit, all those questions and praise would not have been different.

It’s not the sports part of the story that gave it more media juice, it’s the cultural. without that part of it, the “hype” would not have been the same

by NVP on Feb 21, 2012 9:48 PM CST up reply actions  

i agree

…as far as basketball is concerned, no, culture wouldn’t have impact b/c the game is the game, it doesn’t care who u are, just how good u are. but another aspect of bball is personnel and the managing of the team. i would say that the Knicks are less likely to be cemented to their all-stars now that they see a decent PG can run the D’Antoni system reasonably well with the right players around him. and with his marketability as a global phenom, that adds to his value to the franchise.

by lfe159 on Feb 21, 2012 10:14 PM CST up reply actions  

Maybe going down an alley we don't want to go down but...

The ESPN headline was absolutely intended to be racist. Is it a real phrase? Yes. But the choice of that phrase, given Lin’s race, was not a coincidence. If Carmello takes 30 shots in his next game, the headline “Carmello Niggardly with Passes” would be a completely legitimate headline, but no one in their right mind could deny that the wording was chosen for a reason beyond Carmello being a ball hog. I don’t think ESPN, as some monolith, intended it. But the guy that hit ‘submit’ was definitely giggling when he did it.

by seanbergmanrules on Feb 21, 2012 9:10 PM CST up reply actions  

disagree

“Chink in the armor” is a very, very, very common phrase. Is it sloppy for a writer to rely on such a cheap cliche? Absolutely. Does that make it de facto racist? Oh, hell no.

And there is no way you can compare “chink” with the n-word. No way. They are slurs of completely different degree and impact.

by grungedave on Feb 22, 2012 7:47 AM CST up reply actions  

That guy was a headline editor

One of his main duties is to come up with clever headlines, so it hard to believe that he didnt at least had some intention to make that reference. With that said, it was 2:30 am, and he must have rushed that in without having it checked, or else there’d be no way that headline goes up. It’s more like a poor decision than being racist.

Chink in the armor is as common of as saying as any, in fact it’s almost a go to for stories like this. Couple with any asian player though, will probably get you fired, doesnt have to be Lin

Jason Whitlock on the other should not have kept his job for his dumb tweet

by NVP on Feb 22, 2012 5:41 PM CST up reply actions  

how in the world...

would you be the preeminent expert on “degree” and “impact” of ethnic slurs? check out the SNL skit on “Linsanity” if you don’t understand what they are making fun of, then u simply don’t get it. there’s no group where it’s ok to dog on b/c u don’t feel as guilty about or they dont get as openly mad about. "hey look, it’s a story about the ‘90s Utah Jazz, let’s title this article “Cracker Barrel”". apparently u feel strongly about Asian ppl being offended by “chink in the armor” it wasn’t too long ago that the n-word was commonly used and was deemed “not that offensive” by those not being called or associated with that word.

by lfe159 on Feb 23, 2012 7:18 AM CST up reply actions  

all sorts of fail here

Learn to use complete words and punctuation and I might take you more seriously.

Nonetheless, it is eminently fair to analyze “degree” and “impact”. Because someone can call me “cracker” and intend it to be a slur and it could not possibly compare with me turning around and using the n-word. If you cannot discern the difference, then you are operating with tunnel vision.

by grungedave on Feb 23, 2012 11:59 AM CST up reply actions  

sorry punktuation police.

lets focus on the big picture here. just try. here’s my point: u say degree of offensiveness, by your standard only, determines whether a particular comment or phrase is out of bound. i say, if it offends a group, then it’s offensive. it is not up to the majority or societal view at that time to deem what’s ok to be offended by. not accepting a group of ppl being offended by something u urself dont find offensive, is irrelevent. but i’m gonna go ahead and take this exit towards “the high road”, i can see this ride is going nowhere.

by lfe159 on Feb 23, 2012 4:04 PM CST up reply actions  

LIN ain't going nowhere...

for one reason! MSG stock! it’s been up 15%+ since the begining of LINSANITY. do the math, dude… that can pay a few Jeremy Lin for a good price that no one can beat. and the fact that Knick to need a good point guard is also important…. if you see their roster, you see why Mike D plays Lin for 36-42 min a game. they got nobody runs his “pick-and-roll” system better than LIN, not Bibby, not Douglas. JR Smith might get throw in for that position, but he’s a ball hog; Shumpert is pretty good, but he’s slower for his defense ability.

Basically it’s “Jeremy Lin: Knick For Life” – at least for the sake of the MSG stocks, for whatever the length.

don't bully me, i am from the D(etroit)!!!

by wanderboy on Feb 21, 2012 3:56 PM CST reply actions  

"linsanity" proves the NY hype machine is in full force.

Iman Shumpert was touted as PG jesus by so many Knicks fans, as was SG jesus Landry Fields, and not to mention Galenari. (sp?) Now Galo actually has the talent to become a good player but Lin comes along and actually puts up stats and all of a sudden it is worldwide mainstream non sports media news.

by alexander_37 on Feb 21, 2012 11:25 PM CST via iPhone app reply actions  

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